In this insightful interview, Dr. Michael Martin, a high school principal and AI enthusiast, shares his journey with AI, its impact on education, and practical strategies for integrating AI responsibly in schools. Discover how AI can be a powerful tool for teachers and students alike, and learn about the innovative approaches at Buckeye Central High School. Principal Martin is also the 2024 Principal of the Year from Ohio and published author on the subject.
Connect with the guest:...
In this insightful interview, Dr. Michael Martin, a high school principal and AI enthusiast, shares his journey with AI, its impact on education, and practical strategies for integrating AI responsibly in schools. Discover how AI can be a powerful tool for teachers and students alike, and learn about the innovative approaches at Buckeye Central High School. Principal Martin is also the 2024 Principal of the Year from Ohio and published author on the subject.
Connect with the guest: martin.mike74@gmail.com
Books by Michael Martin:
- Blending Instruction with Technology
- AI Powered Leadership: 50 Prompts to Transform Your School Today
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Contact Cool Coffee host, Principal Rick Sola: rfsola@olatheschools.org or KPACoolCoffee@gmail.com
The mission of the Kansas Principals Association, an organization committed to educational excellence and the lifelong success of all students, is to develop and support all principals through optimized learning, collaborative leadership, networking, and service. Read more about the KPA HERE.
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SHOW TRANSCRIPT
Rick Sola (00:02.824)
Hello and welcome to Cool Coffee with Kansas Principals. My guest today is Dr. Michael Martin, a sitting high school principal at Buckeye Central High School in Ohio, also the 2024 OASSA principal of the year. He's an author and what he calls an operational realist. While tech futurists talk about what AI might do in 10 years, Dr. Martin helps overwhelmed leaders figure out how to use it safely by next Tuesday.
As the creator of the ART leadership model, he shows organizations how to escape administrative drudgery and win back time for intentional human connection. He is the author of Blending Instruction with Technology, and he's here to help us turn AI anxiety into a competitive advantage. Michael, welcome to Cool Coffee.
Mike (00:53.035)
Hey, welcome Rick. Thanks for the invite. I appreciate it.
Rick Sola (00:56.702)
Yeah, I am super excited to have you on. And as we connected about this podcast and this topic, AI, I literally this morning was in a district meeting where AI was a topic. And there are so many different, I guess, thoughts about AI. And you, I think, it very well, kind of talking about the good, the bad, the ugly, or maybe the helpful as well.
So I'm really excited to get into AI here with you. So I would love to just start with AI, you, where did this connection, I mean, this is a new technology, when did you get connected with AI?
Mike (01:44.076)
Yeah, that's a fair question. I've I've always been really interested in technology, the integration of technology, how to utilize it in schools, how to use it in classrooms to better what we do. When blended learning was a big deal back 10, 15 years ago, I did a lot of research on that. That's actually where I wrote my first book, Blended Instruction with Technology.
And it's really when I started, know, to kind of do some speaking and touring and speaking and just kind of laying out how to utilize technology in the classroom. And ever since then, I've always been kind of trying to my best to, you know, to perfect, I shouldn't say perfect, but to use the science of teaching and the art of teaching and integrating that with the technology that we have at our disposal. And so obviously AI is a big deal now, but.
I was on the AI bandwagon pre-COVID. I was reading about AI, I was thinking about AI. I'm like, this is coming down the road, right? I was reading about it then. I didn't know what I know now, obviously. But I was thinking about it, I was looking in the future regarding that. And when we came out of COVID, I took an MIT class and I built my own AI just to get a fundamental understanding of how it all works. So I've always had this appreciation for technology. I've always had this...
Rick Sola (02:45.478)
Okay.
Mike (03:11.912)
I don't know this need to be on the edge on the cutting edge of what we're doing. I just, it's just a lot of fun for me. So I've always been, you know, trying to look to the future to see how things are being used. And of course, you know, we're smack dab in the middle of AI right now. And I'm hoping that the Buckeye Center, what we're doing here is just a little bit, you know, ahead of the curve compared to other schools, just because of, you know, my interest in the
and the topic of technology. And I'm gonna add this real quick, Rick. I don't think it's just me that has this interest in technology and how it's being utilized, not only in schools but in the workforce. I mean, we can go back to the 1930s, right? And I can show you articles, I can pull up speeches by presidents that advocate for the use of technology and how it's gonna change the American life, right? How it's gonna change our work week. mean, the next...
There were presidents who promised that with the advent of technology by the 1960s, we will cut our work week in half. Well, that hasn't happened. Actually, I think it's doubled. I think it's doubled, right? But so I think there's always been this fascination. There's always this urge, this want to utilize technology to help us live better lives, to help us do what we do better, right? And so it's just been a lot of fun for me.
Rick Sola (04:15.252)
No, that's not.
Rick Sola (04:32.915)
Yeah.
Well, it's interesting. I'm familiar with AI. I use it every now and again. I am very much surface level as far as I use it to research vehicles or things like that. know, very surface level. But you mentioned pre-COVID AI and that you were involved in. this is my ignorance. didn't even...
really, as I think of AI, I think of a technology, at least that's been widely available to the public over the last two to three years really coming onto the scene. What did AI look like pre-COVID and then this many years, six, seven years later, that's almost, I mean, that's almost a lifetime for technology ramp up. So.
Mike (05:19.15)
It is a lifetime, yeah. The terminology back then was machine learning. Remember the machine learning, which is in essence the birth of AI.
Rick Sola (05:23.994)
Okay. Yeah. Yeah.
Rick Sola (05:30.546)
Yeah, okay. Well, you know, and I remember it all started with, you know, predictive, your Netflix queue and what, you know, some of that sort of thing or Amazon. So,
Mike (05:36.802)
Yes, it was, yes. Amazon also knows what you want to purchase, right? Netflix knows what you want to watch. Predictive analysis.
Rick Sola (05:44.648)
Well, you said you took a course at MIT about how it all works. And for those who might be listening who are maybe very primitive with their knowledge of AI, or they've maybe purposefully stayed away from it, how would you, in a nutshell, just describe, OK, how does it all work for those who are new to the game?
Mike (06:05.664)
It is an imperfect but getting a lot more accurate predictive machine, as you mentioned. That's what it is. It runs numbers and it predicts based on the algorithms. What's really fascinating is everything is a number. For example, when I was building the first AI that I built through this course with MIT,
I was using Google, of course, and Google's tools. Well, one of the ones that we built was, I should say, I built was we, I took pictures, I don't know, using the software through Google, a thousand pictures of a basketball. I took a thousand or so pictures of a football and took a thousand or so pictures of a soccer ball, right? And then I would categorize those pictures by
what ball they were, what sport they were. And what would happen then is the machine would take every little single pixel, right? Every single pixel of that picture is a number, right? And it formed patterns out of all those numbers of all those pictures. And it knew that this pattern of numbers represented a basketball. This pattern of numbers represented a soccer ball. This pattern of numbers, right?
represented a football. I knew that, right? Because it was just a pattern of numbers. And then based on the new pattern numbers I would give it, it would try to predict what that was. So for example, like I, again, I threw a thousand pictures of a basketball on there. After I set it all up, I would take a picture of a basketball.
I had an AI take a picture of the basketball and it would tell me what it was. It would accurately say this is the basketball, this is a football, this is a soccer ball. And I know that's very simplistic, but that really is the basis of what AI is, right? It's just using numbers and patterns, right? To recognize, it's just using numbers to recognize patterns, right? It's using numbers to recognize patterns and it's using patterns to predict other patterns.
Rick Sola (08:25.524)
Okay, so it's predictive because it recognizes a pattern of numbers and you throw out another picture of a basketball, it figures out, this is a close match to what we've, you what's been programmed. So that's kind of what's been programmed. Of course, we can go down a total rabbit hole because I'm totally intrigued at the learning machine and how it starts to, I don't know if making decisions is the right word, but you know,
Mike (08:36.127)
Yeah. Yeah.
Rick Sola (08:51.922)
The good, the bad, the ugly, I would maybe even add the scary. There's some things in there that start to get brought up. OK, no, so that's a really good kind of baseline for how it works. And you've done a lot of talk talks on how it works and how it looks in your school. And we haven't talked really about this before, but it sounds like you have you have embraced it. And so at your school, it's it's very intentional about.
Mike (08:56.074)
Good.
Rick Sola (09:21.012)
teaching kids how to use it, your staff, yourself as a principal. What does that look like?
Mike (09:27.007)
You know, first of all, the reason I'm really intentional about using AI in our school is without government oversight, the genie's on the bottle and we're not putting it back in, right? The good, as you said, the good, the bad, and the ugly, right? Without some sort of government overreach, AI is not going away. people are using it more and more every single day.
When I step back and I look at the students that walk our hallways and I start thinking about how I'm preparing them for the workforce right now, but how am I also gonna prepare them for the workforce in 10 years? I'll go hang out in our preschool. And I started thinking that 13 years, those kids are gonna be seniors. And in 17 years, they're gonna be graduating college. What's the world gonna look like when they've been working for 10 years, which is 27 years down the road?
So I think about that a lot. And again, AI is not gonna go away. So I've come to the realization that there is an equity gap when it comes to artificial intelligence. And it's not necessarily who has access to AI, because every single kid has a phone these days. So every single kid has access to AI. What I think the equity gap is, which kids are taught to utilize the AI?
right, as a thinking tool. Like I hear the phrase thinking partner a lot. I use the phrase thinking tool, right? A partner sounds more human to me, right? I mean, I love my wife, she's my life partner. You know, she's not a tool, right? And so I call it a thinking tool. So who teaches their kids to utilize AI as a thinking tool, right? Not to think for them, not to replace their thinking, not to take away the struggle of the thinking.
but as a tool to enhance their thinking, as an add-on to their thinking, as a way to think more and learn more and critically evaluate on another level, right? If you can do those things.
Mike (11:36.426)
in the world four to seven to 10 years from now, I think you're gonna be a better spot than those students where schools are not talking about it, schools are not using it. And those kids are just using it all willy nilly. They're not utilizing it with any forethought, without any reasoning, right? They're not using it to the extent that our kids are using it, right? And that's a competitive advantage for us, right? That's the equity gap.
Rick Sola (11:59.422)
First.
I really, you the perspective you brought up about talking about your preschoolers and when they graduate and then when they're in the workforce, 10 years and that's 27 years down the road. That's a real perspective kind of, you know, we tend to think of graduation and what does that upon exiting college job look like, which for some of our students in the system are maybe within five years. And we just mentioned, you know, technology changes so, so quickly.
What you were just describing really segues very nicely into it. I've read that you've talked about this before and perhaps probably in your book, the 80-20-2080 rule. And I mentioned before we went recording here is just reading just the brief little bit I did. That really kind of, it just kind of clicked, it resonated, but explain that 80-20-2080, the rule.
Mike (12:38.227)
Yeah.
Mike (12:53.801)
Yeah, so the 80-20-20-80 rule really is the fundamental part of it is the first part, the 80-20. So I get the opportunity to travel and talk and speak about artificial intelligence and its uses in not just the classroom, but as a principle in the building, whatever it may be. And the presentation that I use, it took me six months to build, right? It took me six months.
I would read, I would read, I would read and I would write. I would read and I would write. I would read and I would write. And so I wrote this outline. It took me six months to write this outline. And then I would, when I got to the point where I was feeling pretty good about where it was and how it felt, I felt really good that it was pretty comprehensive. I uploaded it to AI and I asked it, so listen, if this is the outline that I...
I gave it the appropriate prompt, had all five parts to it or seven parts, whatever it is you believe makes up a good prompt. So I wrote the appropriate prompt, but ultimately asking it to critically evaluate this outline that I have of this presentation. I asked it to then provide me with a list of errors. I asked it then to provide me with a list of best practices I might be missing.
This is the critical part, right? I tell it, don't just write it for me. Don't just put it in the outline. Give me links. Give me live links and resources so I can go read about those best practices I'm unaware of, right? So then that's what I did. It gave me a list of stuff. I spent, I don't know how much time going out and reading all that, thinking about all that. Some of it made sense to me and I utilized it.
Some of it did make sense to me and I didn't utilize it. And so when I got done with that outline, 80 % of that outline was my original beginning draft, my original beginning thoughts, which I struggled with, which I did the reading, the heavy lifting and the messiness of the struggle of learning. I did all that. The additional 20 % was artificial intelligence being a a thinking tool for me.
Mike (15:18.983)
which expanded my world, expanded my knowledge base, I went out, learned more, added more, and then put that into my outline. So 80 % of the outline was my original, 20 % was the enhancement because of AI. That 20 % I never would have had, had it not been for the tool. Never would have had it. The 2080 then comes in, the 2080 then comes in, I turned that then into the presentation, right? So I uploaded that into, and you can choose whatever.
AI presentation software you want to choose, but I uploaded it in there, right? And it spent, I don't know, about three minutes creating an amazing presentation for me, right? And I went through that presentation, I looked at it, it created the product for me. I went through that product, I evaluated it, I critiqued it, but then I went and added some parts I thought was missing, the human parts to it as well, right? Some things in there that I thought was,
innately, naturally me that I would want to see or hear myself give in a speech, in a presentation. I added that to it. So the product was 80 % generated by that artificial intelligence based on my outline, and then the additional 20 % of me going in and being the human in the loop. So that's the 80-20-20-80 rule. Does that make sense?
Rick Sola (16:39.654)
It makes total sense. what I love about that is it, you know, if you had, you know, where you're at, I don't know how many assistant principals you have there, but zero. Okay. Okay. Or you have your, you have your office staff and you have some others, but if you pulled them in and you ask them to do basically what you typed in as a prompt, but like, Hey, I need some feedback. This is specifically, that's what collaboration is. And so you're kind of simulating collaboration with
Maybe not a thought partner, as you say, but it's a tool. You're using a tool there. And so taking 80 % and just enhancing that to create what it is you're ultimately trying to achieve. There's people all over the country that spend hours in rooms full of people brainstorming different things. You're just brainstorming with the platform that you're on.
Mike (17:31.927)
That's what I'm doing, right? I really do get an opportunity to brainstorm with maybe some of the smartest minds in the industry, right? I do, right? Which I would never have the chance to do had it not been for the technology. But I think it's critical that we also address that the first 80 % of that thing was me, right? Because that's the true learning. When we start thinking about our kids,
Rick Sola (17:42.685)
Right, yeah.
Rick Sola (17:48.372)
So how do you, go ahead, go ahead.
Mike (18:01.275)
And this whole idea of cognitive offloading or what I call a cognitive atrophy, you know, that struggle, that messy struggle of learning, right, where the synapses in your neurons are firing and they're connecting, you know, that beautiful messiness, that beautiful struggle, right, that's the heart of learning. And I hate when schools allow or organizations allow or families allow AI to replace that.
Rick Sola (18:29.62)
How do you create a, I guess, a culture and understanding, expectations even, building that into your school, into the classrooms amongst your teachers? Because 80, 20, how tempting for students is it to, let's go 70, 30, blah, blah, blah, you know, and they start sliding that over. Can we slide that over?
Mike (18:47.069)
I know, I know. And that's a great question. It's not hard to sell it to my staff, because I think every teacher in America is scared of this thing cheating for them. Cheating for the students, I think all teachers are scared of that. So it's not a hard sell to the staff. But I'm one of those leaders where I literally meet and I talk with our kids, right? It's just me and them.
and I address them at the beginning of every school year. What I think is a rather inspirational talk, whether they think that or not, I don't know, but I leave rather inspired. And we do these last two years, we've talked about AI and I talk about them and where I want them to be in 10 years, where I want them to be in 15 years. And I show them, you know, the impacts of cognitive atrophy or cognitive awful and whatever you want to call it.
Right? And then I show them, you know, again, what I call the messiness of the struggle, the beautiful struggle, right? And the benefits of that. And then we equate it to lifting in sports. I equate it to exercising in sports. I equate it to all of that. Right? So I get them to, I'm trying to get them to understand that the brain is a muscle. you don't want it to atrophy. It truly is, I think, the great differentiator as we move forward in future. Because if you look at AI,
products or AI outputs, you do find a lot of similar words, a lot of similar phrases. You find a lot of similarities, right? You really do. And I do. I get afraid of our voices becoming too similar. And the way to keep yourself more authentic, the way to keep yourself not being similar to everybody else is to use your own.
brain, is to use your own thoughts, is to develop your own voice. And I do, I talked to our kids about the importance of developing their own voice and their own thoughts. you know, does that solve all the problems? No, but it certainly helps to mitigate that, right? And that's just how we start. And then after that, we start talking about in our classrooms, when we're using AI, for example, we're adopting magic school for next year. And why are we magic school for next year? Because you can see the conversation between
Mike (21:05.844)
the teacher, I mean, I'm sorry, between the student and the AI. You can see that process. You can see the thought process, the communication, the collaboration, as you will call it, right? You can see all of that. So then that becomes my next conversation with our staff members is, if we wanna make sure that we're sticking to this 80-20 rule, and that's not a hard, fast number, it's just the number I use. If we wanna stick though to the majority of the thinking being our kids, then we have to...
to see the process of the conversation. We have to see that the prompt, the response to the prompt, and then our response to that output, right? We have to see how kids are interacting with the AI, and we have to be able to see all of that. And that's really for us the best judgment of whether or not kids are maintaining that 80-20, 70-30 balance we talked about. Does that make sense?
Rick Sola (21:58.132)
Yeah, it does and you mentioned that the prompt and you said earlier, you know the five or seven points of a good prompt and I'm thinking I don't I don't know I don't know those prompts and so that's something that you know, I've kind of learned by failing or you know, I go you kind of tweak it but How does a person know? mean, I guess in a school you can be intentional but about teaching it you've had a lot of real kind of you know Personal experience, I guess with with that you've also had a class
Mike (22:07.156)
Yeah.
Rick Sola (22:26.516)
Is that potentially something we're missing in our schools right now is we're not teaching how to use AI? You know, I know there's some resistance to it like hey, you're right and I brought this up on on here before it reminds me so much I remember when Google really started to explode back in like 07 08 or whatever and there was there were like two camps of teachers of hey, we need to teach them how to use Google it's not going away and then there was the other side of
No, they are not allowed to use Google and this is, it's like Google's not going anywhere. Now here we are. It's like, yeah, it's still around. We better teach them how to use it and how to use it responsibly. I see that with AI, but there are the resistors. Are we missing something in schools, do you think?
Mike (23:10.942)
You're talking to a tech enthusiast, right? So I'm gonna say yes. I'm also gonna tell you that I can show you some articles, some op-eds in the newspapers back in the 1840s, where they were upset and fired up over the damnation of the future of America, the number two pencil, right? I can show you that, right? We've always been afraid of technology. You know what mean? The Luddites existed for a reason, right? We've always been afraid of technology. We always have.
Rick Sola (23:14.472)
Hahaha
Rick Sola (23:28.819)
Ha
Mike (23:39.645)
But we've always managed to harness the power of technology. And I'm not gonna say that we've always managed to harness it to the benefit us the way that we thought it could, because I don't think we've ever done that. But we've managed to harness the power of technology to at least avoid the pitfalls that everybody was afraid of. You know what saying? We've always done that. But I will say this, AI is a different beast. It's not a number two pencil. It really is a different beast.
But I again as I said earlier, I don't think it's going away. It's not you know, it's not going away I think you are missing something you are missing the boat if you're not teaching your kids how to use it because I am Right and when my kids leave here and they're competing against your kids in this world I think my kids are gonna have the upper hand right they're gonna have a competitive advantage. I think they are
Rick Sola (24:26.718)
Yeah, I really feel like I remember very vividly a pre internet world. That's how old I am. I can remember the world before the internet. But I remember it coming onto the scene and I remember the changes. And of course, here we are. think AI is this generation's kind of internet. They're going to remember the world before AI.
Mike (24:33.348)
Yep.
Rick Sola (24:47.686)
And then it's going to be like, how do we ever have it, not have it, you know, it's that big and it's just evolving so quickly. What have you seen and what do you acknowledge is truly a real challenge of working with AI in schools with students? What do you see as the biggest?
Mike (25:06.735)
This is not just students, It's human beings. Human beings always, it's how we're wired. It's not your fault, right? But we're like water, right? We wanna find the path of least resistance. It's natural. Your brain needs to manage the energy that's being expended, right? It just, does. So you try to find the path of least resistance. So kids will, and adults,
Right? We'll try to utilize AI to cut corners. They just will. And so I think the biggest struggle, or at least one of the struggles, I shouldn't say the biggest, but one of the struggles we have is really convincing all of us how to use it right. Right? Don't let it replace your thinking because it's so easy to do. Right? Like, how do you still want to make sure that you're, again, as I say this all the time,
get into the messiness of the beautiful struggle of learning, Still making sure that we're doing it. So I think that's a problem, not just for kids, but for adults in general. And then here's the other thing too, right? And this is an old number, and you're gonna laugh when I say it, because it came out in October, but it's old. It's six months old, it's a bit outdated. But...
When chat GPT released some data back in mid late October a million a million users per week, right? We're we're utilizing a conversation with chat GPT regarding suicide, right? That's a problem. All right that that is you know, and one of the things that if you follow me if you read by right
Rick Sola (26:49.054)
Right.
Mike (26:54.922)
One of the things I talk an awful lot about is what I call the, it's called AI squared, right? I think in every organization, in every school, there's two forms of AI. You have artificial intelligence, and then you have the adult inhabitants of that organization, right? You have two of them. Here's my question for people. Why are kids turning to AI, right, for the social-emotional issues, instead of the adult inhabitants in the building? What's going on there?
Why is that happening? Why is there a million users per week having conversations with AI regarding suicide? Why is that happening? That's a concern. It really is.
Rick Sola (27:40.114)
Are there any statistics, you know, and I wonder if it has to do with the anonymity they feel like they have with with AI, but is there any statistics of? Yeah, I have heard and read so many of the just the awful tragedies that have occurred out of it, and I think that's what you know that those are our headlines that people who aren't as familiar with AI, they see, and I think that's where some of the fear of AI comes in. But statistics where AI has.
has helped or has it been kind of a one-sided deal just based on your your research?
Mike (28:12.78)
You know, I can't tell you the number you're asking for right now, because I don't know that, but I can tell you this.
In Ohio, we have help lines that the kids are allowed to call and contact when they're struggling. That's anonymous. Yeah, we're not getting a million hits per week in Ohio. We're not getting 10,000 hits per week in Ohio. We're not getting a thousand hits per week. I don't know if it's a thousand, but we're not getting those numbers, right? And that's anonymous, right? So why are they turning to AI? Because it's in your back pocket? Because it's your back pocket? Or is it because it's on your phone and you just dealt with a social media issue on your phone?
Rick Sola (28:40.03)
Right, right.
Rick Sola (28:44.136)
Yeah. Yeah.
Mike (28:51.666)
you know, and you don't know how to deal with it. So you're just taking your phone and going to the next app, which is your, you know, your Gemini app, whatever it may be. And that's where you're I don't know. But I will tell you, I don't think creating a an SEL AI bots the answer, you know, I don't think creating another AI bots the answer to that, which I know some people are doing. And here's the other thing too, that that I think we need to keep in mind, when we train AI,
We're training AI with every available data that we can pull off the internet, That's where it's coming from. Well, all of our social media is on the internet, right? All of our social media is on the internet. Social media is being fed into AI to help train it, right? That's a big source of the training, at least it used to be, for AI. And I don't know if you've noticed, but people aren't always kind on social media, right?
They're not always nice on social media. They're not. And if that's what we're feeding into AI, doesn't surprise you sometimes that AI is not always nice back? Doesn't surprise you sometimes that AI suggests that maybe you should probably commit suicide?
Rick Sola (29:59.262)
Right. No, that's.
Rick Sola (30:04.404)
Yeah, it's very interesting. There's so many layers. I feel like truly I scratched the surface, but it's so intriguing because you can kind of see where it's going. Technology, it's an exponential graph on its growth. with AI, just like you mentioned, October, I joked about pre-COVID, that's ancient history. But October kind of is when it comes to AI.
But I know you are using this at your school. And as a principal, it's being very helpful for you, like you mentioned, as a tool. I'd love for you to share a little bit about what does AI do to help you on your day to day? What does it look like?
Mike (30:52.478)
Yeah, and give me one second. I'll jump into that, but I do want to give a shout out. I'd be remiss if I didn't. I have a STEAM teacher here who's amazing. She's also our athletic trainer and she's also finishing her degree in admin. And so she had to do a project this year for her admin and she chose to do AI. And she's worked really hand in hand with our staff this year with surveying kids, surveying staff, trying to find out, you know,
where our students are when it comes to AI use, where our staff is when it comes to AI use. She set up some PD for our staff as well. So what we're doing at Buckeye Central simply is solely is not me. I am really, really blessed to have Amy Betts. That's the other individual who's been doing a lot with us too. So let me give a shout out to her. I'd be remiss if I did not. She's been amazing. But to answer your question, there's a lot of ways that you can use AI as a principle.
So again, I don't want AI to replace me. I don't want AI to replace my thinking. But I do want to find ways that AI could save me time, help me be a little bit more strategic with my time use, help me be a little bit more consistent. So if there's something that I use a lot, like if there's a task that I do a lot, I try to use AI. I don't like to go to Gemini and
or chat and write a prompt, because if I do it a lot, I'm always writing the prompt. So I like to build bots or gems or GPTs, whatever you want to call them, for tasks that I do a lot. So, and then I also, I like to look for pain points. Like what's a pain point that impacts my world that maybe I could use AI to solve? For example, you may have this problem in your school, and I'll bet you to guess that most of our listeners have this problem.
It's hard to find substitutes, is it not? It's hard to find substitutes. It's even harder to find really good substitutes. I mean, there's days we just get people who have heartbeats that are in the building, right? Just so we're covered for liability reasons. And so one of the things that I wanted to make sure I did for our staff was I wanted to find, create a better way for them to make quality lesson plans
Mike (33:14.355)
for substitutes, right? And so I sat down and I did the 80-20 thing. I wrote what I think would be the ideal lesson plan for a substitute, not for a teacher, but for a substitute. I'm thinking about my building. I'm thinking about the instruction that happens in my building. I'm thinking about the instruction that happens in each classroom and the expectations that I have. And if I'm gonna have a substitute in there, I still have expectations, right? And so I wanna create a lesson plan that meets that level of
expectations. So I developed that lesson plan. And then I connected that lesson plan to every single standard that exists for every single class that we have. I built this bot. And I also have a number of teachers, you know, who have young children and young children get sick at six o'clock in the morning and are vomiting. And now the teacher can't come to school, but the teacher didn't have a lesson plan. So what are you going to do that day? Right. So now all my teachers need to do is they need to log on, type in the standard or the topic.
that they're teaching in the grade level, and it creates a lesson plan for them, right? Devised specifically for substitutes, right? And it generates it within seconds. And then they simply just share it with me and my secretary, and we print it out and we're ready to roll. We're ready to roll, right?
Rick Sola (34:34.014)
So you're talking about building a bot. I think I know what you're talking about, just in case, just in case there's people listening that don't, explain that. What do mean you're building a bot?
Mike (34:40.223)
Okay.
Mike (34:47.73)
So, and maybe I'm oversimplifying the term for our listeners, we're a Google school. I'm guessing most of your listeners are probably Google schools as well. So we use Gemini. And inside of Gemini, you can create gems, right? So I created a gem that's specifically designed to develop high quality instructional lesson plans for substitutes, right?
And I mean, when I say high quality, mean, it gives, creates, you know, I can statements, measurable I can statements, I want those, right? Measurable I can statements. It's a high, thinking back to when you were in college, the lesson plan wasn't that intense because sometimes they're over the top, but it really is the most important parts of what you need. And then I even, when it was being used, I still noticed that when I do some walkthroughs that,
Some of the substitutes were struggling still, to deliver the content the way I wanted to. And some of them were just heartbeats and didn't know how to deliver the content. So then I added to this gem. Now it creates the lesson plan, but it also creates a script too. So all the teacher has, all the substitute has to do is get up and just start reading the script, right? And then it stops and tells, now the kids will do this and the kids go do this. But that was a pain point for me.
It was a pain point for me because I have high quality teachers, great teachers, and there is no substitute for good teaching, but I also want my teachers to be really, really good parents. I want them to be really involved with their families. And so when they have a sick child, I don't want them to have to worry about the lesson plan or coming to school because I want them to be a parent, take care of their kids. So how can we create, how can I use that as a pain point to use AI to alleviate that pain point? So that's what we did. We built these gems. So that's one way.
I use gems to do data analysis for me.
Rick Sola (36:54.516)
How does that look? And I know there's a lot of talk about being careful. can't put personally identifiable information. You've got data. You've got students attached to that data. How do you dump it into a Gemini and let it do its thing safely?
Mike (37:07.058)
It's anonymity, right? Like you literally just replace the names with the code, right? So I have spreadsheet, has all the names and the data on it. I make a copy of that spreadsheet, right? And then I just give the names a number. That's all I do, right? And so spreadsheet A, Mike Martin, spreadsheet B, number one. Mike Martin is number one, right? I upload spreadsheet B and we're off and running.
Rick Sola (37:30.228)
Sure. You've got your spreadsheet of student data. Give an example of a prompt you would use that would be effective, you think would be effective to, let's say it's discipline data, and you're trying to use it to determine either infraction or time of day or whatever, just from an effective prompt standpoint.
Mike (37:55.558)
Yeah, so I'd start off probably telling the the prompt that you know it is a it is a high school principal in state of Ohio. Who is an expert at data analysis.
who has uploaded some of your discipline data and that you are working with your PBIS team and you want to analyze the data that we have for discipline. We also want to analyze the data that I've uploaded for attendance. I also want to maybe analyze the data that I've uploaded for some of our grades, whatever data I have, right, for PBIS I uploaded, right? And then I also say for us, you know, there are certain goals we have for our
our PBIS and I'll let them know here's the goals that our PBIS is focused on, our PBIS is focused on this year. know, highlight for me, or based on the data, provide for me some high level data analysis of what we can pull from the data, know, high level data analysis that we can use to interpret and to...
move forward and meet these goals. Something like that, right? I'm sorry, you kind of caught me wicking in on my feet, but something like that. in essence, I'm giving it a name. It knows what its role is, right? I'm giving it some information. has information with the data that's being uploaded to it. It knows that it's Ohio and Ohio is PBS and here's my goals. And it knows that, you know, we want to look at the data as opposed to those goals. What are some areas of strength? What are some areas of weaknesses? I may ask for it to do a
Rick Sola (39:12.05)
Yeah. Yeah.
Mike (39:38.295)
a
Mike (39:41.835)
Shoot. A SWOT analysis too, right? What are some strengths, weaknesses? What are some areas of threats that we have as well? mean, somebody asked me to do a quick SWOT analysis if I wanted to. I can do a lot of things with it, and within seconds it generates it for us.
Rick Sola (39:59.392)
Yeah, that's really cool. And like I said, I mentioned, yeah, I say on the surface, I'm more more familiar with it, but super intrigued. actually had, I don't know if you know the name, Trevor Gertson, but out here, I know he tours around a little bit, but he did some PD with staff. And this was about a year and a half ago. And it was really about how you can help yourself and some tool building and being.
having this tool work for you and be an assistant essentially. so, no, super, super intriguing. And I feel like I could just keep asking all sorts of questions. And it is, you mentioned the, it is not a number two pencil. You know, it is not. There's definitely the hesitation with technology, but this is unique. But there's certainly, there's a lot of...
Mike (40:43.852)
It was not.
Rick Sola (40:55.444)
Just a lot of things to kind of think of. And I really enjoyed hearing about just all the positive ways. Let's say there's someone listening right now and they're just, Mike, I hear you, but we gotta keep this away as long as we can. What would you say to that? Because certainly there's not just value in the short term, but kind of like you mentioned, 27 years from now, what
Mike (41:22.99)
My first question is why? You know, why? What are the fears you have? What are the concerns you have? Right? Let's get those down. Because to be fair,
Rick Sola (41:24.126)
what the workforce might look like. But what would you say to someone who's really just digging in heels with AI? And as you see it, as you understand it, and as you kind of forecast it, what would you say to that person?
Mike (41:51.821)
there are some legitimate concerns, right? I mean, let's face that head on. Let's face it head on. I'm going to ask why. And then we're going to get a list of all those concerns and all those fears have, right? And then we're going to have discussions about those. And we're going to talk about how we can create systems, how we can utilize this tool to still reach the means that we want and still mitigate those fears and those concerns. Because don't.
You're going to get the cheating thing, right? That's going be the number one concern you're to get from teachers. Well, they're going to cheat with this. Well, it's going to do this. Well, you're right. Kids have been cheating though, ever since they've been asked to learn on their own, right? Ever since they've been asked to take a test. Human beings have found ways to cheat, right? That's always going to be there. And we've always tried to find ways to stop them from cheating, right? This is just the next iteration of that, right? So how are you going to stop them from cheating? Let's discuss how we're going to do that, right? What do we need to do on our end to do that?
And so that's the first thing I'm do. The second thing I'm gonna do is I really am gonna try to show them the benefits that it has, not only for them, but for the kids too, right? And let's find out where they are, where's their comfort level when it comes to utilizing AI. one of the things that I've done is I've built a survey that can tell me where you fall on what I call the ART spectrum, the ART, right? And so where do you fall in that spectrum?
And if your person's been fighting and resisting it, you probably fall into A, right, on the lower end of the spectrum. And if you do, that's fantastic. Let me show you some AI tools. Let me show you some AI prompts. Let me show you some ways you can use AI at your comfort level where you're at that's not gonna, that's gonna mitigate some of those risks and concerns that you talked to me about. And you can see the product and how that not only helps your students, but it can also help you too.
All right, that's my two-pronged approach. Does it always work? No, it doesn't. But I do find that it works more often than not. And then I'm gonna come back to this. It's not going away. It's just not. Let's not send our kids out into the wild west without having a gun at least, right? Let them put some bullets in the gun for them for love of me. Let them know how to go out there and survive.
Rick Sola (43:52.126)
Yeah, that's great.
Rick Sola (43:58.292)
Yep, 100%. No, is not.
Rick Sola (44:11.122)
Yeah, it's not going away. It's more and more relevant. And even just in this school year, have seen just more of the understanding of just that sentiment. It's not going away. We need to really be more proactive, whether it be at an individual school, a district or even states, as you mentioned, you know, government involvement potentially and all that sort of thing. No, I love this and really enjoyed your insight on all of this and could.
certainly spend more time on that. want to make you reference your book. What is the name of your book again for AI?
Mike (44:46.764)
Well, yeah, the first one I wrote was learning instruction with technology, which is actually still relevant. But the other one I wrote was AI-powered leadership.
Rick Sola (44:57.492)
All right, I will link those in the show notes as well. No, all really good stuff. Mike, we have a tradition on this show. We always finish with an opportunity to brag on your people. You already mentioned Amy Betts. You already bragged on her. But you know, as well as I, we cannot do the job and we cannot do the job well without amazing people around us. So this is your opportunity to brag on the people of Buckeye Central High School out in Ohio.
Mike (45:13.002)
He's amazing.
Mike (45:28.117)
Listen, the high school staff at Buckeye Central is barring on the best there is. They're amazing in every way. I know all principals probably say that about their staff, but I'm here to tell you, that's true for ours, right? Listen, they understand that this is the direction we need to go. They may not all think it's the best direction to go. They all have some fears and some concerns with it, but they are pro kids so much that they're willing to put their fears aside.
They're willing to put their concerns to the side, right? And try their best to make sure that we teach our kids how to use this right. And so listen, a huge shout out to the staff just in general. They really are really, really good. As I said, Amy Betts has been an absolute rock star this year. Zach Capel is, I think, maybe one of the best teachers in the state of Ohio, if not the best math teacher in state of Ohio. And he is such a tech guru himself.
He's been using AI, he's been embracing gems. He did some PD for our staff using gems again, Google's gemini's version of bots, right? So he's been a rock star. I can go on and on and on and I will if you want me to. But certainly I am blessed, I know that. I am blessed to be around some pretty amazing people who've made what I do.
a whole lot easier. Sometimes I'm just the madman behind the desk with crazy ideas and they make it actually happen, right? That's why I'm certainly blessed.
Rick Sola (47:01.054)
Well, it's awesome and some really, really nice words about your people out there and really enjoyed hearing about all the great things that you're doing at your school, specifically with AI, a topic that is not going away and only more more important that our kids have an understanding so that they can be responsible with it. Like I said, this is kind of the Google of this generation potentially. It's not going to go away and.
Mike (47:27.57)
Nope.
Rick Sola (47:28.414)
they're going to use it too, that's the thing. They're going to use it so we need to show them how and how that can be appropriately used and beneficial.
Mike (47:38.44)
That is accurate. I think the stat IREV is like 86 % are using it. All so we're already behind. We're already behind, so.
Rick Sola (47:47.07)
Yeah.
Well, Dr. Martin, thank you so much for your time here at the end of a Friday. I really appreciate it. And we'll keep an eye out on the developing trends two weeks from now. It's a whole new AI ball game, because that's how quick it changes.
Mike (47:53.05)
Thank you!
Mike (48:03.752)
It does, doesn't it? And that's the hard part, right? Is how do you keep up with a tool that changes as fast as it does?
Rick Sola (48:10.29)
Yeah. Well, hey, have a nice weekend. Thank you for your time and all the best to the rest of the school year for you.
Mike (48:16.463)
Hey, thanks. You too, Rick. I appreciate it.
