Penk, Peters and Citizens Arrests (LIVE with Tracey Martin)

Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines goes live at the Hannah Playhouse in Wellington — sold out in a week — with a very special guest: Tracey Martin, former deputy leader of New Zealand First, former Minister for Seniors and Children, and current CEO of the Aged Care Association.

An episode that moves from the psychodrama of National’s leadership crisis to the slow-motion crisis in aged care — with an insider’s account of life in the New Zealand First caucus along the way.

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In this episode:

* National’s leadership crisis — Penk’s defenestration and what comes next — Phil walks through the numbers with forensic clarity: Luxon is lucky to be standing. The week that preceded the vote was arguably the worst of his premiership — the small business comments, the MMP referendum blurt, the Air Force plane to a party fundraiser, wages up 2% against inflation at 4.1%. Chris is blunt about Chris Penk: a good minister, probably not the only one involved, and now made an example pour encourager les autres. Tracey offers the most nuanced reading: what if Penk was genuinely motivated by loyalty to the party and believed a new leader would save the election?

* Inside the New Zealand First caucus — and was the Peters outburst planned? — Tracey Martin spent years as one of the most senior figures in New Zealand First, and she doesn’t pull her punches. She describes her own caucus colleagues as occasionally weird — but notes that every caucus has weird people, because weird people deserve representation too. On Peters telling Lawrence Xu-Nan to go back to his own country: she had her husband check the Hansard. All Lawrence said was “are you vaccinated?” What followed was not planned — but that, she argues, might be the more alarming conclusion.

* Citizens’ arrest, aged care and the promises nobody can afford — The episode’s final stretch is its most policy-dense. Chris dissects the Crimes Amendment Act’s enhanced citizens’ arrest powers: who decides what constitutes reasonable force? What happens when a 40-year-old man sits on a 15-year-old child? Phil cites the Police Association, Retail New Zealand and Business New Zealand all opposing it — because all the evidence shows that fatalities in retail crime happen when retailers chase or tackle offenders. Tracey adds the constitutional concern: the law says you can detain someone if you merely think they did it. On aged care — Tracy’s professional domain — the warning is stark: superannuation is the base funding model for all residential age care in this country. TOP’s policy of transitioning away from superannuation was designed without understanding that, and she has had to explain the consequences to them herself.

Along the way: Tim Groser performing with Sam Neill at Downstage in its heyday, Annette King messaging Chris to be nice to her cousin Tracey, Chris describing himself as Captain Smack in National Party circles, Count Binface polling between 20 and 30% in Clacton and Tracy’s observation that misogynists exist in every party — not just New Zealand First.

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🎙 Wellington sold out. Christchurch is next — second week of September as part of the Word Christchurch Festival. Tickets available now at wordchristchurch.co.nz.

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