EP 145: Leading Through Outrage: Why Moral Imagination Matters with Dr. Kurt Gray

How do we stay awake and aware without constantly being outraged? Or, perhaps even worse, normalizing what should be utterly unacceptable?

Staying human is hard in this environment. So many leaders are trying to hold onto their boundaries and values against pressure to act contrary to them, to stay compassionate and curious when so many forces benefit from and encourage our outrage.

Anger, rage, and outrage are powerful and can be useful emotions. But when we live from a perpetual state of outrage, we lose access to the self-leadership and adaptive skills that help us lead well, and eventually it takes us out.

Today’s guest is here to help us understand what outrage really is, why it’s so potent right now, how it becomes weaponized, and how we can use it without losing ourselves.

Kurt Gray is a social psychologist who studies our moral minds and how best to bridge political divides. Gray received his PhD from Harvard University, and now directs the Deepest Beliefs Lab at The Ohio State University. He also leads the Center for the Science of Moral Understanding, which explores new ways to reduce polarization, and is a Field Builder in the New Pluralists, which seeks to build a more pluralistic America.

Gray’s work on morality, politics, religion, creativity, and AI has been widely discussed in the media, including the New York Times, the Economist, Scientific American, Wired, and Hidden Brain. He is the co-author of the book The Mind Club: Who Thinks, What Feels and Why it Matters, and the author of Outraged: Why We Fight about Morality and Politics. 

Listen to the full episode to hear:

• How Kurt’s childhood experiences with his stepmother’s conservative, evangelical family have informed his thinking about how we can connect despite differences
• How our human wiring for threat detection causes “harm creep,” even while many of us are safer than ever
• How our outrage is connected to our perceptions of our risk and vulnerability
• How our moral imagination helps us maintain our empathy and humanity without losing sight of our values and boundaries
• Why we need to learn to recognize destruction narratives and how they’re being used to sow division
• Why leading with facts and statistics fails in moral and political arguments and how we can more effectively begin to bridge the gaps
• Why we need to leave room for uncertainty and humility in our convictions

Learn more about Kurt Gray, PhD:

• Website
• Connect on LinkedIn
• Moral Understanding Newsletter
• Outraged: Why We Fight About Morality and Politics and How to Find Common Ground
• The Mind Club: Who Thinks, What Feels, and Why it Matters

Learn more about Rebecca:

• rebeccaching.com
• Work With Rebecca
• The Unburdened Leader on Substack
• Sign up for the weekly Unburdened Leader Email

Resources:

• Atlas of the Heart: Mapping Meaningful Connection and the Language of Human Experience, Brené Brown
• Rage Becomes Her: The Power of Women's Anger, Soraya Chemaly
• EP 96: Rage to Action: The Leading Power of Women’s Anger with Soraya Chemaly
• Brené Brown on the State of Leadership in America Today | On with Kara Swisher
• EP 52: Charlie Gilkey: Leading With What Matters Most
• Daryl Davis
• Saja Boys - "Your Idol"
• Stranger Things 
• Bad Thoughts
• Ordinary People Change the World Series, Brad Meltzer and Christopher Eliopoulos