Guest Aydin Paladin: The First Right Wing Youtuber We Watched

In this episode of Based Camp, Malcolm and Simone Collins sit down with longtime right-wing creator and social scientist Aydin Paladin (one of the earliest anti-woke voices online).

They discuss her path from trying Norse paganism to Christianity after a near-death experience, starting her channel during the 2016 Trump campaign, the replication crisis in social science, and why the right needs its own researchers.

Aydin shares details on the Beowulf Foundation’s projects—including Wolfings Publishing (reviving out-of-print and banned books), the Witan conferences, and upcoming parallel-economy tools like VPN and DNA services.

The conversation covers the evolution of the online right: from libertarian edginess and Gamergate-era aesthetics to pro-natalism, tech optimism, monarchist thinking, and building real community instead of pure reaction. They also dig into what the left’s next major cause might be, the gender dynamics shift on the right, cancellations, the mentorship gap for young creators, and why democracy as currently structured is under strain.

Check out Aydin channels (AydinPaladin + ScienceSibyl) and Wyflings Publishing for books by Ed Dutton, historical works, and more.

Episode Transcript

[00:00:01] Malcolm Collins: I am very excited to be with you all today. Today, we have on a guest, Aydian Paladin, who is a online right-wing content creator that I watched before we became right-wing. When we still voted Democrat, I watched her channel. So you can thank her channel in part for converting...

[00:00:25] I don’t know what you did, Simone. But for converting both of us. And, and tha- this is one of the things that I often tell people about- Mm-hmm ... you know, you end up converting somebody between teams. , You often don’t think about it as just, like, a numbers game. But that person can then one day go on to be influential themselves, or, and I think the most important thing, is the positive impact it often has on individuals’ lives.

[00:00:49] When they start being like, “Hey, you know what? Maybe I should do, like, a monogamous marriage.” Like, or, “That, that’d be neat.” And then you end up you know, having a bunch of kids and being like, “Oh, this is, is pretty fun.” But Welcome on the show. What I wanted to start with, because you’re very unique among the guests that we’ve had, in that you were part of wave one anti-woke, right?

[00:01:14] Yeah. Like, Nux has been on the show, and he’s been making stuff for him forever, but he didn’t become a right-wing guy until fairly recently. Yeah, yeah. Right? But you were out there so long ago, and I actually find this to be very interesting the... Your contemporaneous voices were people like ShortFatOtaku when he was still somebody who people listened to in this space.

[00:01:38] Simone Collins: Yeah.

[00:01:39] Malcolm Collins: And I find the difference in both of your careers sort of since then, and both of your ideologies since then, to be sort of an interesting story in how this wider movement developed. So can you sort of talk about that? Like, what first got you into this? And, and a quick note for people, you used to be a...

[00:02:00] actually, maybe a more interesting question. You used to be i- into Norse mythology. Like, that was your religion. Oh,

[00:02:04] Aydin Paladin: yeah. What made you change? Well, I didn’t, I didn’t talk about it too much on the channel, but I, I, I was you know, I was trying to be spiritual, faithful, because I’d read the research on it, and it’s- it’s a positive thing.

[00:02:15] Well, I never really believed in it, but I tried to convince myself of it. I had a near-death experience now six years ago. I was in hospital for months. And then I you know, saw that I thought that was my calling to Christ, and I’ve been a Christian ever since. So, you know, that was my path there.

[00:02:29] Was it

[00:02:29] Malcolm Collins: really just the near-death experience? Or were there- Yeah ... like, things you were reading around that time or other things you were doing?

[00:02:35] Aydin Paladin: It may have been as well. I, I never f- felt anything for the, the Norse paganism stuff. It was, that was a response to research says that this is good for you, that this helps provide meaning in life and the sense of purpose.

[00:02:47] But it didn’t... I, I guess I couldn’t really... I never really believed in it in the way that, you know, having a near-death experience, as many, as, as often reported will give people a, a different kind of perspective on things, right?

[00:02:59] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

[00:02:59] Aydin Paladin: And going, “Oh, maybe I need to reconsider this a little bit more seriously as your weight of your soul is on it,” you know?

[00:03:05] One way or another potentially.

[00:03:07] Malcolm Collins: This is, it’s very interesting that you answer that way because it’s literally the same thing happened to us- Mm. Yeah ... where we first became religious because we were having kids- Mm-hmm ... and we were just like, “Well, all the research says they’re better off if they’re raised in a- Yeah

[00:03:20] religious household, so we’ll pretend.” Yeah. And then we started reading the Bible and being like- Mm-hmm ... “Wait a second, this seems, like, weirdly true and sense-making- Yeah ... in a way I didn’t expect given the, you know, prejudices I had.”

[00:03:34] Aydin Paladin: Yeah. It was- Same thing for me as well. Yeah, I, I’d grown up with, particularly growing up in the ‘90s, I think there was a lot of, at that period of time, and late ‘80s and 2000s as well, I guess, up until quite recently there have been these very negative connotations in public sort of mass media about Christianity being or, or any kind of faith as being ascientific.

[00:03:54] Whereas actually I found that many things that are presented in the Bible and in you know, biblical [00:04:00] narratives going all the way back, ‘cause to, to the Christian story itself are actually- Yeah ... cogent with the scientific narrative as well.

[00:04:06] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. But it- I, I often, you know, at, when I’m telling parents, like, how do you keep your kids in the religion and everything like that?

[00:04:14] Arguing with the science is not a bad way to go, to be like, “In just reality, like, look at society right now. It doesn’t- Yeah ... seem to be working, right? Like, do you want to...” I, I wanted to get, when you created your channel originally, did you conceive it as, like, a science and psychology channel?

[00:04:31] Aydin Paladin: No, I don’t. I, well, sort of.

[00:04:32] At that time I was taking a sabbatical from doctoral school. I had been in doctoral school at the time. I, it, I ended up just leaving, but at the time it was just a sabbatical ‘cause I was really stressed out and I was, I was talking to my... I used to call my dad every day and I’d talk to him about... It, this was during 2016.

[00:04:48] I, I, or it would’ve been 2017. It was right before the election. Mm-hmm. Trump’s first election. And it was during that el- that campaign cycle. I would just call him every day and I’d talk to him about politics, and he said, “Why don’t you go make a YouTube channel and talk to people in the ether instead of calling me up every day and talking to me about it?”

[00:05:05] Malcolm Collins: What a thing for a parent to say. Oh my God.

[00:05:07] Aydin Paladin: Well, I wasn’t, I wasn’t in grad or that would’ve been doc school. I wasn’t in doctoral school at the time ‘cause I was taking some time off, and I just ended up, I really liked doing it. I was very stressed out with doc school, so I just decided not to go back, and I got to do what I wanted, which was talk into the ether about politics you know, as as it interested me, but also be able to talk about my first passion and what my background is in, which is social science and statistics, and talk about how, you know, even though it’s social science I think this is a, a bit of a, something I lament with the right wing more broadly.

[00:05:38] There’s sort of a distrust of science, and particularly- Mm ... a distrust of social science. That is warranted. Yeah. And it is the replication crisis is 49.3% of all studies in behavioral science can be replicated, so it, there’s a major, major problem in social science, and there’s a lot of political bias that goes into it.

[00:05:55] But if you know how to read the studies and look sort of through the BS and just look at statistics, then you can actually find a lot of useful information, and largely it aligns with right wing perspectives on the world because- Of course it does. So, you know-

[00:06:10] Malcolm Collins: Well, no, I, I, I think that this is a really important point I wanna flag here, which is yes, the field is heavily captured, but that doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t be doing as much research into it as possible.

[00:06:23] Mm-hmm. Because with understanding how people think, how society moves, the differences between men and women- Mm-hmm ... we can act in a way and build systems that are better in the long term. Yes. And so- Yeah ... that requires that we have our own people out there doing stuff. Before we get too far into this, I want to now plug this new thing you’re working on- Yes

[00:06:48] ‘cause it’s really cool. And it fits this idea of we need to have our own social scientists, but not just our own social scientists, but when, you know, people are getting canceled all the time, and people pulling sponsorships from them, and recently I’ve been like, “You know what I wanna do? I wanna get our company to a place where we can just give people sponsorships whenever they lose one.”

[00:07:06] And we can just make a product for whatever product that’s been pulled from them. And you’re already working on a wider project like this. Can you talk about that?

[00:07:14] Aydin Paladin: Yes. Yeah, recently I was brought on to do marketing and PR kind of stuff, which is why I reached out to you in the first place, to see if you would wanna work together with this.

[00:07:21] Mm. It’s actually not one company. There’s sort of a, an overarching company that runs things. But which is the Beowulf Foundation. But from this one organization, we have a lot of different companies and organizations that work with us. Now, for a couple of years now, we’ve had our publishing house, which is Wolfings Publishing, and we not only have contemporary works from people like, Dr.

[00:07:41] Ed Dutton, The Jolly Heretic. Mm. But we also have historical works, many of which were previously out of print or outright banned. So for example, one of our, our top sellers is Like the Roman: The Life of Enoch Powell by Simon Heffer. That was originally published in 1998, but it was out of print for years because, well, talking about Enoch Powell is a little bit [00:08:00] of a taboo subject for some people.

[00:08:01] He’s considered too extreme, too right-wing for some people. We also have our magazine, The Corncrake, that we you can buy there as well. And there, we constantly have new publications and old publications that we are reviving and bringing back. So that’s kind of been our flagship is our publishing house, which makes a lot of sense coming from th- you know, this kind of side of things.

[00:08:19] A lot of these books have been lost, or they will be lost if we don’t preserve them. And then we’ve also started taking over Shieldings and, and working with Shieldings, which is our live events, and we’ve been putting on the Witan now for, ooh, I think it, this is the fifth year, which is a live conference in England.

[00:08:34] We also now do them in Germany as well. I’ve lived in the UK for the last seven years, and actually it is in not this, this upcoming weekend, but the weekend after, this year’s Witan- Oh, cool ... in in England. Witan. Which it is always a great event. Just it’s- Oh ... a live talk. Sorry, continue.

[00:08:49] Malcolm Collins: Well, a, a, a Witan is traditionally the name- Mm-hmm

[00:08:51] for, like a, a Celtic council, right? Yes. So they, they, that’s what they named it after?

[00:08:56] Aydin Paladin: Yes, it’s a meeting of, of kings or lords and, and learned people. So that, that is where the name comes from there. And I, I think it has been five years now they’ve been putting it on. It’s a fantastic event.

[00:09:06] Malcolm Collins: You’ll- And you said they had other projects-

[00:09:08] come to LA ... like VPNs or something? Yes.

[00:09:10] Aydin Paladin: That is planned. I can’t announce it officially yet, but we do have a VPN. We will also have a DNA ancestry analysis. And again, the whole kind of point of this is to have many heads of the Hydra, many arms of the octopus so that we can provide alternative service or alternative access to these same services that people already use except for, from an ideologically and politically aligned group.

[00:09:30] And I’ve always- Oh ... wanted people to do this stuff ... I have some connections- Yeah ...

[00:09:33] Malcolm Collins: with your DNA-

[00:09:34] Aydin Paladin: Mm-hmm ...

[00:09:34] Malcolm Collins: project that might be useful. Oh yeah,

[00:09:37] Aydin Paladin: for sure ...

[00:09:37] Malcolm Collins: because, you know, we know some companies that the more DNA they can get, the better. Yes, exactly. For, for doing better research. Mm-hmm. Because a lot of the, the companies, the, like the big national data banks like the UK National Data Bank shut down public access- Yes

[00:09:51] the moment somebody noticed that one sub-demographic had smex with their daughters at a rate of- Yes ... like 5,000% any other demographic, and then they said, “Publishing that is hateful.”

[00:10:04] Aydin Paladin: Which was unfortunate, ‘cause the, the- Yeah ... UK’s DNA stuff was some of the most well-copped. It was extremely- Yeah ... extremely useful.

[00:10:11] I had done research using their databases before, but yeah, of course you can’t get access to that now for political reasons.

[00:10:17] Malcolm Collins: Mm-hmm. Yeah.

[00:10:17] Aydin Paladin: Unfortunately.

[00:10:18] Malcolm Collins: Okay. So to go back to so guys, go check that out. We’re gonna mention it again at the end of the episode. Beginning to build our own products, our own counter community of, of, like, networks of products I think is really, really important.

[00:10:33] Yeah. That way we have Chud Tech on where you can up-vote and put your own products- Yeah ... in, on, on RFAB. It’s the, it’s the- Yeah, yeah ... control button. Yeah. Trying to share other people’s projects who are making cool stuff, just because the, we have such an enormous capability anyone who’s watching this right now, to make your own things.

[00:10:50] And that’s the only way w- we can... It is going to be very hard for us to recapture the institutions, right? Like, when organizations go woke we might be able to starve them like what happened with, like, E- what, what, what was the company? Ubi- Ubisoft. Oh, yeah. But, like, we can’t... No matter... They’d literally rather go bankrupt- Yeah

[00:11:10] than hire, like, a consultant like you or me to come in and clean it up, right? You know. And so that means the only option for us is a, a parallel economy.

[00:11:19] Aydin Paladin: Yes, indeed.

[00:11:21] Malcolm Collins: But to continue, when you first came on YouTube during that Trump election- Mm ... did you consider yourself right wing or did that happen later?

[00:11:30] Aydin Paladin: You know, I, I was very... I’d never been very, very political. I was a little bit when I was a teenager, and I was a libertarian. So, I, you know, Ron Paul libertarian. I loved Ron Paul. I wrote in Ron Paul- Yeah ... in 2008. So I’ve always been, I guess, right leaning. So it wasn’t, there wasn’t a big shift for me.

[00:11:45] But, you know, I did buy into some, a lot, a lot of the sort of common ideas that are, are left-leaning of the popular gestalt about, like, gay marriage and things like that and homosexuality more broadly. S- you know, there were a lot of things that were just kind of in the milieu [00:12:00] where it had become normalized to such a degree that, yeah, sure, I went, “That’s...

[00:12:03] I don’t see the problem with that.” Of course, you know, love is love or whatever it happens to be. I’m, I’m not like, you know, and I hate gay people now, but however, there’s certainly issues there, and that requires some thinking outside of the heterodoxy, or excuse me, the orthodoxy and the homogeneity of thought within pop culture.

[00:12:20] So.

[00:12:21] Malcolm Collins: What’s really interesting about what you’re saying here is, I mean, I would have during that time period considered myself a libertarian. Mm-hmm. Although I never would have said the word libertarian- ... because I, I find libertarian groups obnoxious. Yeah. But I would like... I, I almost feel like there was a period where the being a libertarian was the basic b***h option in life.

[00:12:40] Yeah. Yeah. And I was choosing that option. And having the same types of subjects that I was afraid to really, you know, the trans stuff I was afraid to look into too much. The- Yeah ... you know, i- e- a lot of the stuff around same-sex attraction I was afraid to look into and talk about. And what I think was really interesting about you as a creator is when you first went out there, while you said stuff that I knew would get me scolded if I said at work or something like that-

[00:13:12] It, it wasn’t really over the line. It was still in the same general field of, like, the type of stuff that ShortFatOtaku was talking about. Yeah. Where it just felt like edgy, original. But you over time evolved to become eventually, like, with the rest of the movement, ‘cause it wasn’t just you and me, it was like-

[00:13:36] Aydin Paladin: Oh

[00:13:36] a generation I mean, Sargon’s been around, you know, he’s been around since that time. Some of the people, a lot of them are gone somebody, a lot of them are gone. Like, I used to be pretty good friends with this guy Dr. Layman. I loved his stuff. He did stuff that was very similar to sort of what SFO or Sargon were doing at the time.

[00:13:51] V is still around. He’s, he’s been around- Yeah ... since, since that time. Arch is still around. So a lot of them are, but a lot of people have just come and gone with, you know, at the time. Well, Arch

[00:13:59] Malcolm Collins: Cast wasn’t political back then, right?

[00:14:01] Aydin Paladin: No, it wasn’t. Well, you know, I, I guess like sort of at some point it started to c- become that.

[00:14:04] But he, he’s been around in the same space for a long time, and so the, some of those people have become more political, some of them have become less political. But who’ve just been around since that time. When you say V, you

[00:14:12] Malcolm Collins: mean Romanian Troll?

[00:14:13] Aydin Paladin: Yes, yes. Okay The Romanian Troll, yes. That’d be- Who

[00:14:15] Malcolm Collins: recently became a what are, what we call them, face fags.

[00:14:19] Oh, yeah ... like who are not, yeah, g- going, going public with their identity. Sorry, she used to be, or like the relationship, my para-social relationship with her- Yeah ... is with like a Sims wave avatar because that’s ... w- was it a- Yeah ... Sims wave style or?

[00:14:35] Aydin Paladin: I don’t... No, V, because he’s the Romanian guy.

[00:14:37] Malcolm Collins: No, you.

[00:14:38] Aydin Paladin: Oh, me. Yeah, sorry. I got... Sorry, I got

[00:14:41] Malcolm Collins: confused. You used to have an image. Yeah. You weren’t always a, a face person.

[00:14:43] Aydin Paladin: Yeah, right. Yeah. I, I, I still I know occasionally, not rarely, or excuse me, rarely anymore, but occasionally I will use the avatar. Yeah, I, I was the, the, you know, cartoon... Everyone did that back then with the PNG tube stuff where you just change out your PNG every couple of after you say something to look like it’s reacting to what you’re saying.

[00:15:02] It was very common. But yeah, I had like a- Oh, wow ... vaporwave, synthwave thing aesthetic, yeah.

[00:15:06] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Why did you choose that, by the way? Because Simone was re- we did our website in a synthwave style and she goes- Ooh ... “Why, why is this so common in like right-wing conversations?” Yeah,

[00:15:14] Simone Collins: why do we all choose synthwave?

[00:15:15] Yeah.

[00:15:16] Aydin Paladin: I d- I think it’s like fash wave ki- it’s like the- ... the cool aesthetic of it. It’s like this, well, that was the future we were promised, I guess, is that maybe not a cyberpunk- Ah ... dystopia, but it’s like everything will be shiny. And I’m feeling the ‘90s. It’s like everything in the future’s gonna be shiny and neon.

[00:15:31] Simone Collins: So. Yes,

[00:15:32] Aydin Paladin: so

[00:15:32] Malcolm Collins: true. Yeah. You know? Well, actually that brings me to an idea here where I think a lot of what our site has increasingly coalesced around fighting for, and I think Leaflet did a good job of sort of synthesizing this with her stellar humanism concept, is this idea of a very optimistic, bright future for humanity where humanity is thriving.

[00:15:54] And actually, I, I don’t know if you’ve commented on this yet, but what’s your take on [00:16:00] the weird sort of way that the right has become the party of technology and AI, and the left has become very anti-technology and AI?

[00:16:08] Aydin Paladin: Well, I, I mean, I think the whole way that the left currently operates is on this it’s not, the sort of third worldest stuff is part of it, but it’s, it’s all very regressive actually.

[00:16:17] They call themselves progressive, but they are regressive. It’s about f- you know, getting people bogged down in the differences between each other and just constant grievance, constant intr- so that you get distracted by the little differences between me and you, between men and women. But we have to also paste all over it at the same time, but be constantly aware of it at all times.

[00:16:36] You can’t move past that. Mm-hmm. You can’t just accept that things are sometimes a way. Mm-hmm. Sometimes things just exist. There are differences between people. They can’t be ameliorated. They will always exist. They have to go in constant... And this is, this is the c- comes from the Hegelian dialectic of everything has to be deconstructed all of the time.

[00:16:51] Mm-hmm. You can’t progress actually towards any sort of future if you are stuck engaging in the Hegelian dialectic and deconstructing everything forever. So I think that’s why they get basically stuck.

[00:17:03] Malcolm Collins: What are your, what are your thoughts on... One, one of, I think the big questions right now culturally is the left sort of abandoned environmentalism.

[00:17:11] Like, you know, even Greta Thunberg- Yeah ... gave it up. They seem to have abandoned a lot of their like the trans movement seems in heavy retrograde right now. Yeah. The, you have the the, they, they, Gaza, when Trump ended that, that really blew their sails out on that thing. Like, what do you think is the next thing for them?

[00:17:32] Their, their next BLM?

[00:17:35] Aydin Paladin: Yeah, I, you know, I’ve been speculating on this, and I can see that what, what interests people, why, what I see them talking about, I think it’s gonna be gender politics again. I think it’ll be right back in 2014 feminism kind of stuff in many ways. Mm. And that might lead back into introducing the transgender stuff.

[00:17:50] They just went too far with it. They went way too far with the transgender stuff. It’s still, it’s, I am seeing it come back up in common discourse more commonly, particularly- Mm ... with the women’s basketball stuff that happened recently. That all stuff, I think particularly in r- talking like very different world now in many ways politically than it was in 2014.

[00:18:09] In everything that has happened in Iran, everything that has happened in terms of foreign policy issues, things like Gaza that the left were very fired up about for years about Palestine.

[00:18:18] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

[00:18:18] Aydin Paladin: And now that’s dissipating. I, I, I feel like, a- and all of the, the more intense sort of racial animus and, and racial discourse of the summer of love, that stuff I think got too intense for people.

[00:18:29] They wanna go back to a little bit of the safe zone where let’s talk about gender politics, because comparatively, that’s more comfortable and safe. That’s- Things got too serious in, in the Middle East.

[00:18:42] Malcolm Collins: That’s fascinating. I, but we’ve sort of had the, the opposite take where we sort of look at, like, Hasan locking Destiny- Yeah

[00:18:48] out of the DNC, and see this as sort of like the, the middle ground guy, Destiny-

[00:18:53] Aydin Paladin: Yeah ...

[00:18:53] Malcolm Collins: being the, the outside, and then the centering of, I guess, what I call, like, the terrorist left, the left that just, like, hates the West.

[00:19:03] Aydin Paladin: Yeah.

[00:19:03] Malcolm Collins: And, and I, so I thought maybe just, like, anti-Western sentiment would be the next thing.

[00:19:08] Aydin Paladin: Well, I think from the right, I’m already seeing a very lot of what I, I would call counter jihad of or return to freedom fries, which is a lot of ruh roh, we are back. It is George Bush as president again in the many of that kind of sense. And on the left you get the opposite, is essentially we’re the pro terrorism side.

[00:19:24] We are- Mm ... pro jihad. Mm-hmm ... and, and that’s the third worldest mindset that I did, I did mention briefly. I’ve seen that as well. I think, yeah, with, with Hasan, I, I don’t know how long his utility lasts to the left, ‘cause you’re also seeing them saying, “Woke one was crazy.” All of the, you know, that stuff, that’s what AOC has said, woke one is crazy.

[00:19:43] I’m seeing more and more of them come out and say, “No, we’re woke too,” which is clearly gonna be something different than maybe the, I think not the transgender stuff. I think that was a massive failure.

[00:19:52] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

[00:19:52] Aydin Paladin: So for them.

[00:19:53] Malcolm Collins: Well, with Hasan, actually, we might be getting him. We’ll see if w- it ends up getting him the platform, but we’re working- Yeah

[00:19:58] right now with the Senate, [00:20:00] what committee?

[00:20:01] Simone Collins: The Senate Commerce Committee

[00:20:03] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, and we put together a big dossier Okay ... like, like 18 pages or something like that of going through the differential treatment that Twitch and YouTube- Yeah ... have been giving people. So we’ll see if we can get something triggered there.

[00:20:13] But I mean, like, the, it, it, it, it’s in the best interest of the administration, so. Yes. I would, I would really like to be fighting against the left where it’s just, like, gender politics again.

[00:20:23] Aydin Paladin: Yeah.

[00:20:24] Simone Collins: Oh, that would, that would be gender again. See, I think e- When you were like, “It’s gonna be gender again,” I’m like, “Please make it gender again.”

[00:20:28] I,

[00:20:29] Aydin Paladin: I think, it’s a hunch, I think there’s gonna be the counter-jihad versus the, yeah, jihad sort of sides, the Third World aside. I do think that’s probably likely as well. But I, I also think people were burned out, and a little bit of comfy gender politics- Comfy ... I think would make some people quite happy.

[00:20:45] So comfy’s so boring.

[00:20:46] Simone Collins: You know, I think, I, I honestly didn’t believe that was the case until this morning, because I thought the big war was gonna be pro-AI, anti-AI. Oh, yeah. Which of course is another really huge thing. But then although I’ve been avoiding coverage of it, the, the Lindsey Clancy trial, someone sent me that a, a huge portion of the internet apparently is just vehemently refusing to believe that this woman killed her own children.

[00:21:10] Aydin Paladin: Yeah.

[00:21:10] Simone Collins: And they’re like, “Obviously the husband did it. And even if she did it, she didn’t do it. He did it.” No, it, ‘

[00:21:16] Aydin Paladin: cause of-

[00:21:16] Simone Collins: Like, they refuse ...

[00:21:17] Aydin Paladin: his, her, their star signs. I mean, it’s, it’s very- Yes ... very, very woman-coded stuff going on there, but women are- It’s so strange ... I, “He’s, he’s got a scary m- he’s got this scary face, I can tell that he’s

[00:21:28] Simone Collins: dark triad.”

[00:21:28] No, it’s merely because he’s a man. Yes, okay. Like, a woman is not she did not do it. Yes. Even if she did not do it, just like this, like, I remember someone saying to me, a notary being like, “Vote blue no matter who.” Yeah. And I was like, “Wait, do people actually do that?” Yeah. Do they just like, “Look, I’m gonna blindly toe a line and no matter what you tell me, I’m gonna toe that line.”

[00:21:47] And I feel like there’s a new line of, like, “I don’t care what you tell me. You know, either men or women, they’re evil. They’re wrong.” Yeah. “They’re evil, they’re bad, and they always murder, and they’re always the wrong one. It doesn’t matter what the evidence is.” So you are probably onto something really good there.

[00:22:01] Malcolm Collins: Well, what’s very interesting if they do go that direction- Yeah ... is that the right of today is not the misogynistic right that existed, like, eight years ago, or like d- during woke one. Yeah.

[00:22:14] Simone Collins: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:22:15] Malcolm Collins: The, the, the A- and anti- Andrew Tate ... Gamergate-

[00:22:17] Simone Collins: Yeah, Andrew Tate’s off. He’s, he’s gone

[00:22:19] Malcolm Collins: to like, The Gamergate community was really mixed with the red pill community- Mm-hmm

[00:22:25] and the pickup artist community, and the Andrew Tate-o-sphere.

[00:22:29] Simone Collins: Yeah.

[00:22:29] Malcolm Collins: And he’s-

[00:22:30] Simone Collins: But now he’s a Taliban icon. It’s a totally different world. Yes. Yeah.

[00:22:33] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. What’s really fascinating is as w- we evolved as a movement, a big part of that evolution has been about, hey, like- Treat women well, right? Like be, be decent, right?

[00:22:49] Like we don’t like the gender war stuff, but like be decent, right? And I think that part of that we’ve, we’ve talked about like why this happened. Actually, what are your thoughts? Why did that happen?

[00:23:01] Aydin Paladin: In terms of why did the right... Well, I mean, there’s still some of that going on. There’s that whole sort of s- side of what I would call, like, right adjacent.

[00:23:08] They’re not explicitly political, but they end up in the same spaces of, like, the looksmaxxers, the clavicular type people who are popular right now.

[00:23:14] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

[00:23:15] Aydin Paladin: Which is... And I, I actually have a scientific rationale for why I think that’s happening. S- and we won’t get more into it with the right people. Go into it, by the way, but

[00:23:20] Malcolm Collins: continue.

[00:23:21] Aydin Paladin: I d- I don’t know. I think part of it is some people have to have figured out at some point that it... Just throwing women out and hating women is not going to be a successful strategy. Yeah. Particularly for a right-wing movement that should have, that should be pro-natalist. Like, the, you know, if y- you at least have to figure out how to tolerate women if nothing else, and not just this, ‘cause, like, MGTOW has massively dropped in popularity. That was a huge thing for years. Not, Yeah ... not, like, men’s rights stuff. There’s still work obviously that needs to be done, particularly in the legal system with that. But the men who were just kind of checking out of society, one of the things I, I came up in my recent research is that women are checking out of sexual relationships as well.

[00:23:59] It’s all of Gen Z. Yeah. [00:24:00] So all of them are increasingly reporting not having relationships for the last three to four months in ways that are much higher than they were just 10 or 15 years ago. So I think people are starting to realize that there is, there have ac- has actually been a gender, sex schism that has been created where people, oh, because of the s- situations in which they grew up.

[00:24:20] If you were growing up during the 2000s or the 2010s in particular, you were coming of age during the 2010s, and during the era of Me Too. And during the era of- Yeah ... also where women are constantly told that no man is good enough for you, you know, that you, you, you have to be, hold, have the highest standards possible.

[00:24:36] Mm-hmm. No wonder those people who are now adults aren’t seeking out relationships.

[00:24:40] Malcolm Collins: Well, I think part of what drove this change that happened in the community is, you know, when I first entered the, the proto version of this community I had been a young man. I’d been socialized to be like, “Your value in society is the women you have sex with,” right?

[00:24:57] Like, that is the measure of a man, how many women you have sex with and how hot they are. And so, you know, going out there and sleeping around a lot, but I want, I want to sleep around more. I want more of that, right? And it is the women who are preventing me from having the more of that. Mm-hmm. And then the community began to coalesce, and the, the, the thing that sort of drove it above all else was a search for what is actually true.

[00:25:24] Yeah. And I think it became obvious even outside of religious mores and everything like that, that wait, this, the, the me wanting to sleep around with a ton of people, that was actually part of the lie. Yeah. That was part of the, the stuff being held over my eyes. And so the, the problems to that, like when you look with Andrew Tate, he converts to Islam so he can have a harem and everything like that.

[00:25:49] Yeah. And I think, That and the getting more into, I’d say, Christian or traditional Western values for a lot of the movement has also been like, “Wait, that’s not cool.” Right? Like, “That’s not a cool thing to do. That’s not a cool way to treat a woman,” right? Mm-hmm. Like, why would you... I wouldn’t want my-

[00:26:06] Simone Collins: Yeah

[00:26:06] Malcolm Collins: and people start thinking daughter and stuff like that. And then the other thing that really changed it, which I’ve mentioned, and I don’t know how much you track this, is the Vtuber community becoming popular in right-wing- Yeah ... spaces and becoming accepted in right-wing spaces- Yeah ... allowed for older women, and when I say older women, I don’t mean old women.

[00:26:23] I just mean it, it, it’s fairly hard to become a female influencer with your face if you’re, like, 30 plus, right?

[00:26:30] Aydin Paladin: Yeah.

[00:26:30] Malcolm Collins: And so-

[00:26:31] Aydin Paladin: I, I’d say it’s probably hard if you’re, if you’re not started, I, I mean, unless you’re willing to, like, unless you’re willing to show a lot of skin and stuff and you’re quite hot, you, you, really, women have- Yeah

[00:26:39] are at a, you know, timescale there, where if you, if that’s, ‘cause that’s the way that the vast majority of women get very popular in terms- Yeah ... of doing live streaming is being very attractive. But yeah, if you’re, you know, a little bit older or something, or you don’t feel comfortable with that, Vtubing a lot, which it, either, it could be all sorts of reasons why you might prefer to be, do Vtubing over being on camera.

[00:26:58] Yeah. It gives a whole new degree of latitude for women to enter the space without feeling like they’re forced to be on camera, they f- forced to look a certain way.

[00:27:07] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Yeah. And well, and that caused, I mean, you were one of the first female influencers in this space, but that allowed for many more offering, I think a female perspective helps moderate us.

[00:27:18] Mm-hmm. But what, what the, the wider point I’m making is if the left goes full on misandrist again, they’re going to be crashing against a force that doesn’t look like the misogynistic opposite that existed on the right in the past, and I think it’s gonna look really bad for them.

[00:27:35] Aydin Paladin: They’re gonna have... If they do, I mean, you know, I live in the Channel Islands, which is, it’s, where it’s not part of the UK, but it’s it’s basically the UK.

[00:27:41] Yeah. And s- so I of course see the Islamification of things, the, the counter-jihad is much more, and, and the jihad aspects are forming marching lines here much more staunchly. That’s all the Green Party is here.

[00:27:52] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

[00:27:52] Aydin Paladin: For example. They have made that pretty much explicitly clear that they are a you know, pro third worldist they are pro jihad, and [00:28:00] Islamic takeover party.

[00:28:01] And I, you, I’m seeing that also as well in the Democrats too, and that’s been going on for years, particularly with the, you know, conflicts involving Israel and Iran, et cetera, et cetera. So you are gonna end up with the left in many ways probably taking over the pro third worldist, pro-Islamic positions.

[00:28:18] And then if you’ve got all, you know, but the left is full of women. It’s full of, of young- Mm ... you know, full of feminist women and old feminist women, people who’ve lived their whole lives, you know, believing in a, a whole slew of very left-wing feminist beliefs now being asked to take in men who don’t believe that they should have any rights-

[00:28:35] Simone Collins: Mm.

[00:28:36] Mm ...

[00:28:36] Aydin Paladin: whatsoever. And, and say, “No, we can get along.” Now this has been a conflict that’s been boiling there for years, but sort of you’ll reach a saturation point, particularly in places like the UK, particularly in parts of Europe that are increasing in, and just not the, you know, flood of the immigrants does not stop.

[00:28:51] So at some point a lot of, it’s gonna, I mean, obviously it was the rape and inquiry report that came out earlier this year. But which is, you know, just a fraction actually of, of how bad things really are. You can’t have feminist beliefs and a feminist you know, pro feminist society that’s also full of people who don’t believe that women should have any rights- Well, I mean, yeah, but then-

[00:29:11] particularly not women of your group that aren’t, isn’t part of their group.

[00:29:14] Simone Collins: Yeah.

[00:29:14] Malcolm Collins: I, yeah, I, I mean, I, I, I wonder, Yeah, and I think this is the fundamental conflict on the left is, is which way does it go? Mm-hmm. Does it go back to moderate feminism or does it just become the party of a third world takeover, right?

[00:29:25] Like specifically a jihadist. Like there, there are parts of the left, what I’ve noticed recently, are more specifically just pro-Islam than anything else. Yeah. And, and sort of violent Islam. That that’s become like the cool edgy thing to be about and we’re increasingly seeing leftist influencers being of, of these- Yeah

[00:29:47] these groups, like Mondami and stuff like this, right? And that terrifies me because I don’t want to be fighting against a group that is that fundamentally evil. Like I, I prefer the two parties of the ‘90s or wherever, where it’s like a polite disagreement. And this, because when it gets existential, what I don’t think the left realizes when they’re letting in more and more people is the right is moving to a more and more extreme position.

[00:30:10] Yeah. And when I talk to the other people I know in this sphere and stuff like this, the takeaway from ICE isn’t like, “Oh, that looked terrible,” or something like that. It’s like, “They didn’t, they did all of that and they still didn’t make that much of an impact?” Yeah. Then we need to go 100 times harder.

[00:30:29] Yeah. A- and then when this happens in places like the UK or Germany where you have much larger populations, it’s gonna look awful.

[00:30:35] Aydin Paladin: Oh, yeah. I mean, that’s, that, that is the major contention currently is, is, you know, Rupert Lowe says, “Millions must go.” Nigel Farage is not, will not go that far, won’t give any kind of numbers.

[00:30:44] But even so, yeah, with all of the, the chaos involving ICE earlier in just this year, which is, it feels like, I don’t know why, maybe it just feels like it was already an age ago when all of the stuff with Alex Preddy and Renee Good occurred in Minnesota, right? Which was a huge, huge news about, you know, oh, we need to stop ICE.

[00:31:02] We need to put a stop to either they’re separating families. Mm-hmm. People were innocent people were getting killed. And largely put the kibosh on a lot of that stuff. It did, it really did slow down and it was like the, you know, Trump’s, well, I think it’s ‘cause Iran happened. But, you know, all of Trump’s sort of pushes at the time, which were all directed towards getting people, illegals out of the country, just kind of was like

[00:31:20] I think people also, they fell out of the news cycle ‘cause they, they realized also, yeah, how difficult it is going to be to get those people out of the country- Yeah ... if you have to drag every single one of them kicking and screaming. Now, there’s other ways you can get them out, you know, that, that they will self-deport under certain conditions.

[00:31:36] But yeah, I, I think that has enough people, I think in many ways dis- feeling disheartened because it is gonna be very difficult. There’s millions and millions of these people in countries, not just, not just the United States. Yeah. But again, you know, Europe is facing a very serious problem, in some ways that is worse than the United States-

[00:31:55] Malcolm Collins: So, so when she says these people-

[00:31:57] because of the origin ... I want to, for anybody who’s watching this with, like, a, a [00:32:00] negative skew- Yeah ... keep in mind, in the UK right now and this is from The Guardian, okay? Yeah. A very left-leaning source. Over 50% of Muslims in the UK do not believe it should be legal to be gay. Note here, I did not say get gay married.

[00:32:14] Yeah. I said be gay. Yeah. Just to be a same-sex attracted individual living your life. That is a value system... Oh, my God. Hmm? Sorry, I am wearing my shirt inside out. I need to-

[00:32:28] Simone Collins: Oh,

[00:32:29] Aydin Paladin: no. Oh. Well, I’ve a- I’ve had it happen to, to... Luckily not me, I don’t think, but I’ve had it, I’ve had other friends do that before-

[00:32:36] where it’s just, you don’t think about it sometimes.

[00:32:39] Simone Collins: With men’s clothes, I think it’s harder. Yeah. And I- Yeah ... I’m, yeah. It, with, with women’s clothes, hardly-

[00:32:45] Aydin Paladin: You can pretty much tell ...

[00:32:45] Simone Collins: poorly constructed. Like, you know, like, clothes are so bad. Oh, yeah. Well, now the giant seams are here and I can see them.

[00:32:52] Aydin Paladin: Some of the terrible, like, stitching. I u- I haven’t done seam work in forever, but some of the stitching’s only, stitching on the inside is awful in women’s clothes.

[00:33:00] Simone Collins: Yeah. It’s, it’s

[00:33:00] Aydin Paladin: painful. But with men’s, they tend to be made a little bit stronger, I think. A little bit tougher. Yeah. At least.

[00:33:06] Simone Collins: More subtle.

[00:33:06] Yeah.

[00:33:07] Malcolm Collins: Yes, okay. But the thing is why- So I’m back. I’m, I, I’m wearing it the right way now, you see? Okay. I’m a very, I’m a very intelligent person, guys. Yes. Yeah. You

[00:33:16] Simone Collins: can put

[00:33:16] Malcolm Collins: on clothing. That’s who you’re getting your, your, your opinions from, right?

[00:33:20] Simone Collins: Oh, my God.

[00:33:23] Malcolm Collins: But actually, have, has there ever been a cancellation campaign against you?

[00:33:28] Aydin Paladin: Not one that’s, that’s- Gotten your tea ... really, I think has gotten too far. You know, way back in the day there was stuff with that guy Crouton Tea, but I was on a big list. I was on a big list with like- Oh ... Sargon and V and all those people I mentioned before. They were all on a list of people who needed to be taken out, but all that was was people being weird on Discord and LARPing.

[00:33:45] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Well, I, I think that actually brings up a, one of the things that really protects you from cancellation is just admitting that you’re right-wing and, and having like right-wing opinions, and it makes cancellations way harder to run.

[00:33:59] Aydin Paladin: Yeah, in a sense. They’ll try to, they’ll... I mean, the whole idea, a lot of the cancellation stuff, a lot of that era, it’s not over.

[00:34:06] It’s just changed sort of in, in the way that it manifests. Mm-hmm. I mean, it’s, it is always the case that people get “canceled” quote unquote for something related to some sort of sexual impropriety, but that’s been going on for, I don’t know, all of human history is, you know, some crimes or sexual impropriety things.

[00:34:20] It’s just the nature of them have kind of changed it, I guess a little bit. People don’t get canceled anymore for so much so, sometimes perhaps, but nowhere near the, the way they used to for just being conservative. Too many people lose their jobs. I mean-

[00:34:33] Malcolm Collins: Yeah ... the

[00:34:34] Aydin Paladin: most insane- Dude,

[00:34:34] Malcolm Collins: yeah, you literally, we’ve- Yeah

[00:34:35] we’ve lost, you- Yeah ... investors, job opportunities and stuff like that just for being... This was before we were extreme. Yeah. This was just over the people aren’t having enough kids, and it’s gonna be a problem for social security. Yeah. That, that is what got us in trouble. And I think- For us, and it doesn’t seem like this is what happened to you, but it definitely was what happened for us, is seeing ourselves be canceled for n- normie f*****g opinions- Yeah

[00:35:01] Pushed us to associate with other right-wing individuals, right-wing spaces- Yeah ... right-wing influencers. And they were just really, really nice, and it was very different than being in left-wing spaces- Oh, yeah ... where I felt like I was constantly, you know... like I remember early in right-wing spaces I had this experience of going to one and I was like, “Well, you know, I believe X thing.

[00:35:25] I believe Y thing,” thinking I was finally gonna say the thing that would get them to condemn me, right? Like- Mm-hmm ... and they’re like, “No, it’s okay. Yeah, whatever. You know, you’re, you’re on our team now. We, we work together.” Yeah. And I really like that feel, and it’s something that I’ve been trying to do more proactively.

[00:35:39] We’re gonna have a, a collab soon with a a VTuber who recently got canceled for saying- Oh ... that men can’t have periods. And, you know, she was- How

[00:35:47] Aydin Paladin: are we still saying that in 2026? Indeed.

[00:35:50] Malcolm Collins: Right? But it’s the Vtubing space, okay? Yeah.

[00:35:52] Aydin Paladin: Right.

[00:35:53] Malcolm Collins: But I think the... Doing things like that within our community, when we see somebody get canceled [00:36:00] for a mild opinion, to immediately go to them and be like, “Hey, come on.

[00:36:05] We support you. You know, we’re here for you. You don’t need to agree with us on everything.”

[00:36:10] Aydin Paladin: Yeah. Yeah, I, I mean, I was fired. Well, I wasn’t fired. I was kind of told to not come back to my doctoral, doctoral program after I started doing the- Yeah ... I started doing YouTube. So that was the only canceling, but that was, that was related to Destiny, by the way.

[00:36:21] It was his community. They... I, I... It was a very, very embarrassing debate. I didn’t know who he was. I’d never heard of him. I just saw someone say, “Someone go debate this liberal.” I was on 4chan and, just browsing. And I was like, “Oh, sure, I’ll debate this stupid liberal.” I was-

[00:36:36] Simone Collins: Oh, no ...

[00:36:37] Aydin Paladin: hanging out at home. I was drunk and high.

[00:36:39] I didn’t know who he was. Oh, no. And so I w- I made a terrible idiot of myself, ‘cause I had no idea I was about to be in front of, you know, 15,000 people. I wasn’t doing YouTube. I was just a random person browsing the internet. But they connected that to me, and so, you know, yeah, then I got canceled for, for that, all that stuff.

[00:36:55] That, that was very, very deeply embarrassing. Hanging

[00:36:56] Malcolm Collins: out on 4chan- A long time ago ... drunk and high, doing public debates. This is very much... you can tell she’s very much on, on tribe, on community.

[00:37:04] Aydin Paladin: Oh, this was- Yeah ... about 10 years ago, though, at this point. This is ... it’s, it’s been nearly, yeah, about 10 years.

[00:37:09] That was a long time ago.

[00:37:10] Simone Collins: It’s a good story.

[00:37:11] Aydin Paladin: Crazy though. Yeah. Oh, man, it was very embarrassing. But- But, you know, they, what they did, they, they called my school. They, they made all these complaints about how I was racist. This was shortly after what had happened with Destiny and JonTron, if you remember that or heard about that, where JonTron, who was a hugely, you know, popular and beloved sort of gaming content creator on YouTube at the time, he got into a alm- it sounds like a very similar thing happened, where he ended up on a, on a public debate with Destiny- Oh, no

[00:37:36] talking about race and IQ. Big topic in 2016, very common No And it was just, yeah, he got, he got canceled. He was removed from a bunch of projects and things. They, they... No, he’s fine now, but that’s, and has been fine for a long time. But I think things were probably at their zenith of, like, left-wing power back, like, maybe up until after, or about, like, the end of COVID.

[00:37:58] Mm. That’s when I think things started to, to cool off a little bit. It’s always awful, but just the extremity. Some guy got canceled because he had... Remember, he wa- he landed a, a probe on a comet or an asteroid? They canceled him ‘cause he had, like, a- Oh, because his shirt ... attractive lady on his shirt Because he had, like, anime

[00:38:12] Malcolm Collins: girls on it.

[00:38:13] Aydin Paladin: Yeah, and it- And

[00:38:14] Malcolm Collins: his friend had made it, a female friend I don’t remember this.

[00:38:15] Simone Collins: That, that’s

[00:38:16] Aydin Paladin: unhinged And

[00:38:16] Malcolm Collins: he was trying to

[00:38:18] Aydin Paladin: That stuff though, the insa- the levels are just, the nitpicking, it’s untenable. Society cannot function if everyone has to be constantly afraid of every single thing they do. What- It just doesn’t work long time, long term.

[00:38:30] Malcolm Collins: Mm-hmm. What’s been really fascinating to me is, it, it very clear that like we’ve been in the same spaces for a long time. We likely went on, on a similar like political journey. But it’s not just that like my personal politics has changed throughout that journey, but there’s been this ... And I think that this really happened post-COVID.

[00:38:51] This merger of our online right with institutional political right. Yeah. Where like we, our people, other former 4chaners are the people staffing the White House’s X feed now and stuff.

[00:39:06] Aydin Paladin: Yeah. And it- It

[00:39:07] Malcolm Collins: cut

[00:39:07] Aydin Paladin: pretty clearly.

[00:39:08] Malcolm Collins: Very obvious, right? Yeah. We were, we were saying this like when Fauci’s diaries came out, and somebody at the, at the team styled it like a, a teenage girl’s diary.

[00:39:17] Yeah. And it’s like very obviously this is like our community and our culture. And it’s been such a feeling of like ... It, it feels really nice. Because b- back in the day when you started I’m sure you probably felt very different from whatever you thought of as Republican.

[00:39:35] Aydin Paladin: Oh, yeah. I mean, ab- absolutely.

[00:39:37] Well, you know, I, I was a libertarian, right? Yeah. I was a, I was a right-leaning libertarian, but I was a libertarian. Y- I’ve changed in a lot of my opinions in, in that sense. But, you know, that, that was always where I fell was in, in that direction. But of course I had nothing to do with, and wanted nothing to do with the neocons.

[00:39:53] I had grown up- Yeah ... despising those people. I still despise them. You know? It, people like Lindsey Graham, you know, rest in peace or [00:40:00] whatever. But, you know, I ... Those people do not represent me, they never represented me. Yeah. They certainly don’t represent young people in any way. No. Anyone who could ... ‘Cause you need young people to be involved in politics in order for political movements to do anything.

[00:40:13] And- Yeah ... the GOP had, was, up until Trump really, was doing an absolutely horrific job of trying to make anyone under the age of 60 consider them. So.

[00:40:24] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Well, and, and what’s interesting is it feels like to me, that battle we’ve won. Like GOP Inc- Mm ... the neocons, the old conservative, they don’t really have a base in our generation or younger, right?

[00:40:37] Aydin Paladin: Yeah.

[00:40:37] Malcolm Collins: But the, the big fight right now, and I feel like we’ve basically already won this fight as well, is against the gripers. Mm. And against the, you know, the, the radical the people who want to go into just like explicitly racist territory and stuff like that. Yeah. And, and or explicitly misogynistic territory.

[00:40:56] And it’s like we don’t need to- But that fight feels pretty won as well

[00:41:00] Aydin Paladin: to me. They’re, they’re reactionaries. Which, you know, I’m, I’m a reactionary in my own way. I, in that, you know, I re- I, I am not pro-democracy. I’m a monarchist. That’s, that’s like, I don’t know, that’s going back the, well, a couple ways.

[00:41:10] It’s in the opposite direction. Yeah. But a, a lot of young men in particular have been massively disenfranchised. Mm-hmm. Yeah. They’re told from their whole lives that they’re evil and they’re terrible, and they go, “Okay, well I am evil. I’m a Stormtrooper.” You know, I’ll do as e- Yeah. They, they ... I’ll be

[00:41:22] Malcolm Collins: as

[00:41:24] Aydin Paladin: evil as

[00:41:24] Malcolm Collins: possible.

[00:41:24] That’s a really good, they got an idea of what the evil Republican was-

[00:41:29] Aydin Paladin: Yeah ...

[00:41:29] Malcolm Collins: from progressives. Yes. And then they decided to embody that, whereas-

[00:41:34] Aydin Paladin: They were told they were

[00:41:35] Malcolm Collins: You have this other- You

[00:41:35] Aydin Paladin: are that thing. Yeah.

[00:41:36] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. And by the way, you know, we’ve had Curtis Yarvin on. Oh, I

[00:41:39] Aydin Paladin: love Curtis. Yeah ...

[00:41:40] Malcolm Collins: through, through Monarchist’s, it’s two takes, right?

[00:41:42] Yeah, he’s a, he’s a friend of our... I, I, I really like him. He’s got really good... We should have him back on, Simone, actually. You should make a note to reach out to him. Sure. That episode did really well. But yeah, the, well, and, and we’ve had Aristocratic Utensil, who’s a monarchist- Yes ... as well on. We have said explicitly on the show multiple times, and this is where the monarchist thing comes from, I think everyone, I think both the left and the right realizes this at this point, that democracy as it’s currently structured is probably not going to continue to work.

[00:42:10] The- No. No ... the, the DSA party, we’ll have an episode on them soon. This is a, the party that, like, Mondame’s associated with, and AOC’s associated with, has now said explicitly they want to banish the Senate and the, and the Supreme Court, right? Like, they, they, the leftists want to move in this direction.

[00:42:25] And- The question is, is basically which party cancels elections first at this point.

[00:42:31] Aydin Paladin: Pretty much. Ar- Aristotle predicts this. You know, he says that that, that cultures will move in these cycles of politics. And at some point, democracies and republics, they will give way, and the next stage after that is autocracy and, and, and monarchies.

[00:42:44] Those are gonna be- Yeah ... the next stages, and then it will go in a cycle like this forever. And by the way, and now history doesn’t follow a perfect pattern there. But y- yes, sometimes you get despots and then you get monarchs, and that tends to be sort of when things collapse after a, a democracy or a republic, a, you know, a system in which people collectivize their action, then a lot of times it ends up in chaos.

[00:43:03] And then afterwards- Yeah ... there needs to be stability. And the most stable s- system, system tends to be something that looks like a monarchy.

[00:43:10] Malcolm Collins: Well, monarchies like even if we just, even if the US government doesn’t collapse, even if the governments in Europe don’t collapse- Mm-hmm ... given the strain on social security that’s gonna come as people get older, and the effect that that’s gonna have on the government’s tax base, and thus ability to operate at the same time as the AI tech lords get richer and richer and richer, you functionally have a...

[00:43:33] What, what’s the word that they use f