Echoes Through Eternity with Dr. Jeffery Skinner

The Quiet Exodus: Why Young Women Are Quietly Walking Away

In this episode of Echoes Through Eternity, Dr. Jeffrey D. Skinner explores a troubling but often overlooked trend: while Gen Z men are returning to church, young women are quietly leaving.This is not loud rebellion. It is not rejection of Jesus. It is a slow erosion of belonging.Joined by Rev. Dr. Kim McLean, mentored by Dolly Parton, Loretta Lynn and others—pastor, songwriter, church planter, and longtime mentor of others—this conversation examines how shame-based formation, unequal leadership structures, purity culture, and unresolved trauma have shaped women’s experiences in the church.Drawing on Barna research, lived pastoral stories, and a Wesleyan understanding of holiness as love perfected, this episode asks a deeper question: What happens when formation fails to produce freedom?Key themes include:• The growing gender gap in church attendance• Why women leave without abandoning faith• The impact of shame-based discipleship• Women in ministry and invisible ceilings• Purity culture and spiritual trauma• Why silence feels safer than staying• What faithful formation looks like nowThis episode is not an indictment. It is an invitation—to listen, to repent where needed, and to build churches where women are not merely welcomed, but needed.REFERENCED RESEARCH & THINKERSBarna Group• Gen Z attendance trends and gender gap research• Studies on church disengagement and trust in leadershipSurvey Center on American Life• Faith deconstruction and institutional trust• Gendered religious disengagementBeth Moore• Public departure from the Southern Baptist Convention• Reflections on women, authority, and ScriptureMildred Bangs Wynkoop• A Theology of Love• Holiness as relational restoration, not behavioral perfectionScriptural anchors used or referenced:• Galatians 3:28• John 4 (Woman at the Well)• Resurrection witness of Mary Magdalene• Ephesians 5 (mutual submission, not hierarchy)Takeaways:Gen Z women are experiencing a quiet exodus from church, indicating a deeper relational breakdown.This exodus is characterized by a lack of belonging rather than outright rejection of faith.The data reveals a significant gap in church attendance between young men and women.Church leadership must address the relational safety and equal treatment of women in ministry.Many young women feel unseen and confined to narrow roles within church communities.The shift observed among young women invites churches to reflect on their practices and priorities.Mentioned in this episode:Peace in that Finds You in the Middle of ChaosCozyearth.com. Use Code Echo for a 40% Discount Dr. Jeffery D. Skinner shares his experience with Cozy Earth's products, highlighting their impact on his family's comfort since moving to Nashville. He discusses the benefits of their bamboo-based bedding and blankets, emphasizing their softness, temperature regulation, and luxurious feel. The episode also includes a special discount offer for listeners. Keywords Cozy Earth, bamboo bedding, temperature regulation, luxury comfort, Nashville, family warmth, discount offer, Christmas gift, home sanctuary, podcast partnershipThis podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis: Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacyOP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy

From Despair to Desperation: Understanding Gen Z's Spiritual Journey

The resurgence of Gen Z in church attendance marks a significant shift within the spiritual landscape, as Dr. Jeffery D. Skinner elucidates in this enlightening discussion. We delve into the implications of this generational revival, addressing the paradox of a declining church juxtaposed with a burgeoning interest in authentic faith among young people. Gen Z’s attendance averages 1.9 times per month, surpassing previous generations and indicating a profound yearning for spiritual identity and genuine connection rather than mere entertainment or social validation. This episode compels church leaders to recognize the need for a revival that is centered on Jesus, highlighting the potential dangers posed by algorithm-driven discipleship, which often distracts from the essence of forming authentic disciples. We emphasize the importance of maintaining an organic, relational approach to ministry, where genuine presence and discipleship are prioritized over numerical growth, thus ensuring that the church remains a transformative force in the lives of young believers, rather than a mere reflection of contemporary culture.Takeaways:The resurgence of Gen Z in church attendance signals a profound spiritual awakening, with young individuals attending church 1.9 times per month on average, surpassing preceding generations' engagement.Revival, characterized by a deepened desperation for authentic faith, is not merely a trend but a significant movement among young people seeking genuine connection with Jesus.Discipleship must transcend conventional programmatic approaches; it should be organic, relational, and focused on forming disciples who can replicate their faith in others.The role of algorithms in shaping spiritual identities poses a challenge, as they often prioritize engagement metrics over meaningful discipleship, potentially leading to superficial faith practices.Church planting efforts should prioritize the cultivation of discipleship over mere attendance, aiming for multiplication that reflects the genuine growth of faith communities.The authenticity of Jesus must remain central in ministry to Gen Z, as they desire a faith that is transformative and not merely an echo of contemporary cultural trends.Resources🔗 Full Show Notes & Transcript: Download📩 Eternal Echoes Newsletter: Sign up for reflections and episode alerts (Coming Soon)🗣️ Reflection Guide: Download questions for personal or group use🎥 Watch on YouTube: [link]Follow Echoes Through Eternity on Apple Podcast:Click Here to SubscribeCarey Nieuwhof's 7 Disruptive Church Trends Report Mentioned in this episode:Peace in that Finds You in the Middle of ChaosCozyearth.com. Use Code Echo for a 40% Discount Dr. Jeffery D. Skinner shares his experience with Cozy Earth's products, highlighting their impact on his family's comfort since moving to Nashville. He discusses the benefits of their bamboo-based bedding and blankets, emphasizing their softness, temperature regulation, and luxurious feel. The episode also includes a special discount offer for listeners. Keywords Cozy Earth, bamboo bedding, temperature regulation, luxury comfort, Nashville, family warmth, discount offer, Christmas gift, home sanctuary, podcast partnershipPeace in that Finds You in the Middle of ChaosCozyearth.com. Use Code Echo for a 40% Discount Dr. Jeffery D. Skinner shares his experience with Cozy Earth's products, highlighting their impact on his family's comfort since moving to Nashville. He discusses the benefits of their bamboo-based bedding and blankets, emphasizing their softness, temperature regulation, and luxurious feel. The episode also includes a special discount offer for listeners. Keywords Cozy Earth, bamboo bedding, temperature regulation, luxury comfort, Nashville, family warmth, discount offer, Christmas gift, home sanctuary, podcast partnershipThis podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis: Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacyOP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy

Selfies in Front of the Cross:When Jesus becomes the Backdrop

SummaryIn this episode of "Echoes Through Eternity," Dr. Jeffrey D. Skinner delves into the often-overlooked dangers of personality-driven church planting. He highlights how the focus on a pastor's charisma can unintentionally shift Jesus to the background, leading to a church culture that prioritizes metrics and visibility over genuine spiritual growth. Drawing on insights from various thought leaders, including Henri Nouwen and Francis Chan, Dr. Skinner emphasizes the importance of maintaining a Christ-centered approach in worship and ministry, warning against the seductive nature of success that can lead to spiritual complacency.Dr. Skinner also discusses the pressures faced by church planters in today's digital age, where constant notifications and social media can distract from the core mission of discipleship. He encourages listeners to reflect on their own practices and the health of their church communities, urging them to prioritize worship that forms rather than merely inspires. The episode concludes with a call to lead humbly, plant carefully, and keep Jesus at the forefront of ministry efforts, ensuring that the church remains a true reflection of Christ's teachings.Takeaways'The most dangerous churches are not the ones that fail.''Worship does not exist to inspire you. It exists to reorder you.''If the church can't function without you, that is not a compliment.''You cannot rest without checking numbers.''Saying no is a form of faithfulness.'Key Resources from this epsiode.• Eugene PetersonPeterson gives language for longevity over visibility.He names the danger of speed, success, and celebrity in ministry long before social media existed.He reinforces your central warning without sounding reactive.Books to reference (essential)• A Long Obedience in the Same DirectionThis book is a direct antidote to personality-driven planting.It frames discipleship as faithfulness over time, not momentary impact.It fits perfectly with your theme of resisting urgency and re-centering on Christ.• Shawna Songer GainesPrimary voice for the episode’s theological frame.Her line—“What is essential is never demanding”—is the backbone.She supplies the foreground vs background image, the Jordan River moment, and Christ-centered worship as re-centering.• Jay Y. KimNames the digital attention problem clearly.Gives language for the inward gaze and how technology disciples us.Helps you connect culture, formation, and ministry drift.church planting, personality-driven ministry, Christ-centered worship, spiritual growth, Henri Nouwen, Francis Chan, digital distractions, church health, discipleship, ministry challenges.Francis ChanServes as the cautionary example.Models humility, confession, and courage to step away.Illustrates how success can still be spiritually dangerous.• Henri NouwenQuoted directly from In the Name of Jesus.You accurately reference his warning about the temptations of relevance, popularity, and power.• Neil Postman-Amusing Ourselves to DeathReferenced for cultural critique.You quote Amusing Ourselves to Death accurately and apply it to digital formation.• James K. A. Smith-You Are What You Love Referenced for worship and formation language.Worship forms desire before belief. Dallas Willard-You reference The Spirit of the DisciplinesQuoted directly regarding grace, effort, and formation.The Spirit of the Disciplines accurately.• Byung-Chul Han-The Burnout SocietyReferenced for burnout and self-exploitation.Used to frame exhaustion without external oppression.Alan Hirsch Chapters:00:00 The Hidden Dangers of Church Planting05:33 The Pressure of Digital Culture on Church Planters10:12 Understanding Personality-Driven Church Planting14:27 The Cost of Success in Ministry20:10 The Role of Worship in Re-centering MinistryTakeaways:The most perilous churches are not those that falter, but those that thrive while neglecting Christ.Worship exists not merely to inspire, but to fundamentally reorder our lives and priorities.When the church operates solely on the pastor's charisma, it risks losing its Christ-centered mission.Saying no to certain demands can reflect true faithfulness in ministry efforts and priorities.A church that cannot function in the absence of its leader is subject to unhealthy dependency.In the digital age, constant distractions can lead to a neglect of genuine discipleship and spiritual growth.Companies mentioned in this episode:Missional Church PlantingDynamic Church Planning InternationalTrivecca Community ChurchCozy EarthMentioned in this episode:Peace in that Finds You in the Middle of ChaosCozyearth.com. Use Code Echo for a 40% Discount Dr. Jeffery D. Skinner shares his experience with Cozy Earth's products, highlighting their impact on his family's comfort since moving to Nashville. He discusses the benefits of their bamboo-based bedding and blankets, emphasizing their softness, temperature regulation, and luxurious feel. The episode also includes a special discount offer for listeners. Keywords Cozy Earth, bamboo bedding, temperature regulation, luxury comfort, Nashville, family warmth, discount offer, Christmas gift, home sanctuary, podcast partnershipPeace in that Finds You in the Middle of ChaosCozyearth.com. Use Code Echo for a 40% Discount Dr. Jeffery D. Skinner shares his experience with Cozy Earth's products, highlighting their impact on his family's comfort since moving to Nashville. He discusses the benefits of their bamboo-based bedding and blankets, emphasizing their softness, temperature regulation, and luxurious feel. The episode also includes a special discount offer for listeners. Keywords Cozy Earth, bamboo bedding, temperature regulation, luxury comfort, Nashville, family warmth, discount offer, Christmas gift, home sanctuary, podcast partnershipPeace in that Finds You in the Middle of ChaosCozyearth.com. Use Code Echo for a 40% Discount Dr. Jeffery D. Skinner shares his experience with Cozy Earth's products, highlighting their impact on his family's comfort since moving to Nashville. He discusses the benefits of their bamboo-based bedding and blankets, emphasizing their softness, temperature regulation, and luxurious feel. The episode also includes a special discount offer for listeners. Keywords Cozy Earth, bamboo bedding, temperature regulation, luxury comfort, Nashville, family warmth, discount offer, Christmas gift, home sanctuary, podcast partnershipThis podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis: Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacyOP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy

The Collision of Expectations and Formation in Church Leadership

The collision between leadership expectations and spiritual formation is a pressing concern that requires careful examination. As we delve into this episode, Dr. Jeffery D. Skinner elucidates the phenomenon wherein expectations solidify more rapidly than leaders can foster spiritual growth within their communities. This discord often leads to heightened pressure as leaders transition from an emphasis on vision to a focus on the complexities of interpersonal dynamics. Dr. Skinner advocates for a deliberate slowing down, urging leaders to prioritize discernment and shared responsibility over immediacy. Through this discourse, we aim to illuminate the significance of healthy leadership that is anchored in faithful formation, thereby equipping pastors, church planters, and ministry leaders to navigate the arduous terrain of growth and change with clarity and intention.When-Expecatons-Collide-with-FormationDr. Skinner, here are clean, ready-to-publish show notes built directly from your transcript and outline. The tone stays pastoral, clear, and grounded in formation rather than hype.––––––––––––––SHOW NOTES––––––––––––––Episode TitleNavigating Leadership in Church PlantingThe Dynamics of Expectations and FormationEpisode SummaryIn this episode, Dr. Jeffery D. Skinner explores what happens when leadership expectations outpace spiritual formation. Church planters often move from vision-driven energy into people-centered complexity faster than they expect. Expectations harden. Systems form. Pressure increases.Dr. Skinner names this collision honestly. He invites leaders to slow down, clarify formation, and resist urgency. Healthy leadership requires discernment, shared ownership, and faithfulness over speed. Formation does not remove pressure, but it does reshape how leaders carry it.This episode speaks directly to pastors, planters, and ministry leaders navigating growth, resistance, and the quiet cost of change.––––––––––––––KEY TAKEAWAYS––––––––––––––• Expectations harden faster than formation• Leadership pressure shifts from vision to people• Discernment requires time, conversation, and restraint• Systems quickly reinforce what leaders reward• Apostolic leadership disrupts comfort for faithfulness• Formation redistributes responsibility and ownership• Healthy leaders protect margin and resist urgency• Change creates real grief and loss for some followers• Naming shifts clearly builds trust and reduces anxiety• Faithfulness to formation sustains leaders long-term––––––––––––––CHAPTERS––––––––––––––00:00 Introduction to Expectations and Formation03:17 Navigating Leadership Pressures05:14 The Role of Apostolic Leadership08:07 Formation vs. Expectations11:25 The Cost of Leadership Change14:17 Conclusion and Future Insights––––––––––––––SOUND BITES––––––––––––––“Expectations collide with formation.”“Healthy leaders name formation clearly.”“Formation invites others to grow up.”––––––––––––––AUTHORS & LEADERS MENTIONED––––––––––––––Brian ZahndAuthor and pastor known for emphasizing Christ-centered discipleship, nonviolence, and spiritual formation.Recommended works:• Postcards from Babylon• Sinners in the Hands of a Loving GodWebsite:https://brianzahnd.comAlan HirschMissional thinker and leadership strategist focused on apostolic leadership and movement-based church structures.Recommended works:• The Forgotten Ways• 5Q• The Permanent RevolutionWebsite:https://www.alanhirsch.org––––––––––––––WHO THIS EPISODE IS FOR––––––––––––––• Church planters navigating early momentum and growing pains• Pastors leading change in established systems• Leaders feeling pressure to move faster than formation allows• Teams learning how to share responsibility without losing clarityShawna Songer Gaines• Lead pastor at Trevecca Community Church in Nashville, TN, with 15+ years in congregational ministry. • Author of The Pastor as Midwife: Life-Giving Leadership for the Healing of the Church (2026), a leadership book that uses the metaphor of midwifery to shape pastoral care and transformation. • Co-author of A Seat at the Table: A Generation Reimagining Its Place in the Church and Kings and Presidents: Politics in the Kingdom of God. • She has written the Breathe Bible study series and speaks regularly at church and leadership events. Podcast Interview – Shawna Songer Gaines• De-Centered Leadership Insights from Pastor as Midwife on Discipleship Conversations — Shawna talks about how midwifery shapes a service-centered leadership model, empowering communities and reshaping expectations for pastors. Listen here: https://open.spotify.com/episode/De-Centered-Leadership-Insights-from-Pastor-as-Midwife-A-Conversation-with-Dr-Shawna-Songer-Gaines?si=… (available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and other major platforms) All Things Discipleship – with Tim & Shawna Gaines• Conversations about discipleship, pastoral formation, and everyday faith. Find it on Apple Podcasts or your podcast app.Author page and book info:https://www.ivpress.com/shawna-songer-gaines ––––––––––––––FINAL WORD––––––––––––––Formation always costs something.But it gives something better in return.Leaders who stay faithful to formation do not just build churches.They shape people who can carry the mission long after the adrenaline fades.In the context of church planting, Dr. Jeffrey D. Skinner offers an astute examination of the often tumultuous intersection where leadership expectations collide with the nuanced process of spiritual formation. He articulates the notion that as church leaders transition from the initial excitement of a new vision to the intricate realities of community dynamics, there is a palpable shift in the source of leadership pressure. Initially propelled by a visionary impetus, this pressure increasingly emanates from the congregation, whose expectations may solidify faster than the formation of healthy systems can accommodate. Dr. Skinner encourages leaders to embrace a measured approach, advocating for a deliberate pace that prioritizes discernment and shared responsibility. By fostering an environment where formation is prioritized over speed, leaders can mitigate the anxiety that arises from unmet expectations and cultivate a culture of trust and collaboration within their communities. This episode serves as a clarion call for pastors and ministry leaders to remain faithful to their formative journeys, understanding that while the cost of change may evoke grief, the rewards are invaluable in shaping resilient, mission-oriented congregations.Takeaways:Expectations often solidify at a pace that far exceeds that of formation, creating significant tension.The transition from a vision-driven approach to a people-centered focus can evoke unanticipated pressures.Healthy leadership necessitates a commitment to discernment, requiring time and meaningful dialogue among leaders.Apostolic leadership is characterized by its ability to disrupt comfort and prioritize faithfulness over maintaining the status quo.Companies mentioned in this episode:Missional Church PlantingLeadership DevelopmentDynamic Church Planting InternationalAlan HirschThis podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis: Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacyOP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy

Coming Monday...When Expectations Collide with Formation

Apostolic leadership serves as a catalyst for the disruption of settled expectations within church communities. This episode elucidates the premise that such leadership does not aim to maintain comfort within established systems, but rather to uphold faithfulness to core principles. Comfort, as we contend, poses a significant impediment to the vitality of church planting and outreach efforts. When congregants become complacent, their engagement diminishes, thus stymieing the potential for growth and outreach. We acknowledge that while systems can provide structure and support, they may also cultivate an atmosphere of ease that is antithetical to the essence of a life committed to the teachings and challenges inherent in a crucified existence.Coming Monday on Echoes Trough Eternity we will discuss In this episode of Echoes Through Eternity, we explore what happens when spiritual formation begins to reshape your pace, your availability, and your leadership—while others still expect the version of you that ran on urgency.Drawing on the wisdom of Jesus, Alan Hirsch, Henri Nouwen, Richard Rohr, and lived pastoral experience, this conversation names the quiet collision between formation and expectation.If you are leading with care, protecting your soul, and feeling tension instead of applause, this episode is for you.Formation always disrupts assumptions.The question is whether you will stay faithful when it does.This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis: Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacyOP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy