Ep 306: The Girls Club

Market Proof Marketing · Ep 306: The Girls Club

In this episode, the ladies take over! Beth Russell is joined by Jen Barkan and Julie Jarnagin and together the three share their Summit recaps as well as how they are dealing with the post-Summit blues. They discuss the passion and excitement that comes with attending a content rich seminar, but also the realities of what that looks like when you go home. They talk about the importance of not being afraid to be vulnerable and admit when you don’t know something. The three dive into the hot topics including Redfin’s announcement to leave NAR and share their thoughts on the situation.

Story Time (01:57)

• Beth shares her feelings on experiencing the Summit as a DYC employee and not attendee.
• Julie Shares how being able to communicate data and answering questions and providing info to leaders from other departments is sometimes like a second language.
• Jen’s son, Sam, has a new plan which is “Acclimate, Accelerate, then Dominate.”

The News (27:00)

• Redfin is Leaving NAR (https://www.redfin.com/news/redfin-is-leaving-nar/)
• Mutiny inside NAR as staffers call for resignations of top executives (https://www.inman.com/2023/09/19/mutiny-inside-nar-as-staffers-call-for-resignations-of-top-executives/)
• Climate Change Pushes Up Home Insurance Premiums (https://www.redfin.com/news/climate-change-pushes-up-home-insurance-premiums/)
• Why Your Starbucks Wait Is So Long (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2023-09-20/starbucks-spends-billions-to-slash-wait-times-with-faster-orders?leadSource=uverify%20wall)
• Resumed Student Loan Payments Shake Up The Housing Market (https://www.probuilder.com/resumed-student-loan-payments-shake-housing-market)

Things We Love Things We Hate (51:21)

• Julie is loving the newest season of "The Great British Baking Show"
• Jen is enjoying the tv show "Suits"
• Beth's new house feels like a tree house and she is in love with it.

Questions? Comments? Email show@doyouconvert.com or call 404-369-2595 and we’ll address them on the next episode. More insights, discussions, and opportunities can be found at Do You Convert All Access or on the Market Proof Marketing Facebook group.

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A weekly new home marketing podcast for home builders and developers. Each week Kevin Oakley, Andrew Peek, Jackie Lipinski, Julie Jarnagin, and other team members from Do You Convert will break down the headlines, share best practices and stories from the front line, and perform a deep dive on a relevant marketing topic. We’re here to help you – not to sell you!

Transcript:

Beth

Welcome to the Girls Club.

Jen

Oh, my gosh. I did not even realize that it was Girls Club until about an hour ago when I was on a call with Kevin. And bless his heart, he was just slowly fading because he's not feeling well. And I said, Man, are you going to be able to be on the podcast? And he goes, I'm not on the podcast today.

Jen

And I said, What? And I said, I guess I'll just be with Andrew. And he goes, Nope, not Andrew either. And I was like, What? I was like, Oh. And he's like, Yeah, it's Beth and Julie. And I was like, Yes.

Julie

Ladies podcast.

Jen

It's fun. Taking over. We're taking over control.

Beth

No offense to the boys, but we are so excited.

Jen

Yes!

Beth

Is going to be a lot of fun. I can already tell.

Jen

Oh, my gosh.

Julie

Yeah, and the first post-summit podcast too. So we got to do it on a fun one.

Jen

Oh, my gosh.

Beth

So, I mean, we're we're going to have a good time. It's going to be, as Jen would say, electric.

Jen

And it's going to be like.

Julie

Electric. Definitely.

Beth

All right. Well, let's get started. Welcome to episode 306. I am Beth Russell. And with me today is Julie Jernigan and the online sales extraordinaire, Jen Barkin.

Jen

Oh, I like it. Yes.

Beth

You always need like that big tie up because you're just so like, okay, the energy is just I don't want to say electric again, but I can't help it.

Jen

I think my next tattoo needs to be a lightning bolt or something like I do.

Beth

But you. I need to get matching ones.

Jen

Sam. Yes, Sam needs to get one that says dominate. And I need to get a lay up. Yeah. Oh, no. This is the latest. This is the latest Sam thing. So, yeah, he. You know, he's working on site at Chesapeake House, and they.

Beth

Love him and.

Jen

Love him. Yes. And I was. I was, like, trying to, like, coach him on something or whatever. And I'm sure they love that and, like, trying to coach them on their on site process. But he goes, Mama, here's the deal. I got to get acclimated first. Then I accelerate and then I dominate. And I'm like, okay. I was like, I can get behind that.

Jen

You're going to get acclimated, right? Get your bearings. Then you're going to accelerate. Then you're going to dominate. And I was like, okay, he's going to be a motivational speaker.

Julie

So that.

Beth

Was like.

Jen

Writing it down. Like, All right, here we go.

Beth

She starts structuring her nest.

Jen

Told you for the content. Yes. Thank you very much. That is.

Beth

Amazing. I love him. I feel like we need to start recruiting for Sam.

Jen

Already telling you.

Beth

In the next like 5 to 10 years, he's just going to he's going to do great.

Jen

Well, he already is. He already told me he's he's got his sights set on NAHB, Rookie salesperson of the Year. So let's put that out there in the universe. He's like, Yeah, I'm going to be there at IBS. So. Lisa Parrish, Sam Bargain, putting it out there. Salesperson of the Year.

Beth

That is awesome. He is. That is the energy we all need right now. And I feel like it is an energy that a lot of us have post summit. So as Julie mentioned, this is our first recording post summit and I'm kind of excited that it's us and.

Jen

We don't have Kevin in the industry. We can like.

Beth

Really talk about it and how it went. Not that we wouldn't want them here as well, but I feel like it's like a little bit more fun with our personalities right now. But it is my first time as a team member and not as an attendee working for the builder. So it was like a mixed bag of emotions.

Beth

I feel like afterwards.

Jen

Like, what do you mean?

Julie

There's definitely like a you get home and you have this like and I don't know if it's like really like really relieved that it's over or if it's like sadness because you have this big built up. So there's kind of a little funk. But I mean, it's good because you loved it and it was amazing. Yeah, I feel like I need to sleep for like two days to still, like, get back into my group.

Jen

We're going to.

Beth

Dive right into story time with this one because so like I said, mixed bag. And I think it's just like what Julie said. It's a mixture of like, Oh.

Jen

Man's.

Beth

It's time. That was like a lot of socializing and I never socialize. I'm always in this cave by myself. And then it's sad also because like, this is the one time year that we in the daily routine would get together. So it's so great seeing people and meeting people for the first time in person that I haven't met before.

Beth

But then I like couldn't help but reflect on my time as an attendee and that emotion that a lot of the attendees are probably feeling of. Part of it is like, Oh my gosh, I suck at my job. So many people are better at this than me. There are so many creative people, but I'm also like loving that I feel that way because if you didn't feel that way, you wouldn't be like you wouldn't have that fire to go out there and do something different and implement something new and apply a lot of the things that all of the wonderful presenters were talking about at these various sessions.

Beth

And so, like, I remember having that fire of like I am ready to hit the ground running and I want to do this and I want to do this, and I have so many ideas. But then I also remember when reality hit and like you get back to the daily grind and how quickly it starts to burn out and I don't want to say burn out because that sounds like super negative, but like it diminishes that flame starts to diminish, right?

Beth

And so I think on art, like Maya now as a do you convert person and a coach that has like direct impact on all of these people that were attending is like, now I feel that fire and a new way of helping their flame stay lit for longer.

Jen

Oh, I like it more. I mean.

Beth

Like it's like we got to find new ways. We have to now.

Jen

Keep them lit. Yeah.

Beth

The water bottle, that energy. Yeah.

Jen

So as you were talking, that's you know, I was thinking about that and I was thinking that, you know, any time you come from a conference or you have this notebook full of ideas right now, like, Oh my gosh, when I get back and I'm going to implement this and we see this a lot happen with our online sales academy, too.

Jen

Like, you know, they come and they're just like sponges and they have their notebooks and they're like, yes, I'm going to go do all the things. MM And realistically you can't do all the things, right. Yeah. So I was thinking when you were talking like advice, you know, is summarize your notes like, so you've got this notebook full of stuff and it's like, go through and highlight the, this is where I'm going to start.

Jen

And maybe you pick three things and you go, I'm going to tackle these three things over the course of the next 3 to 6 months or whatever, and then keep revisiting that notebook and it can be overwhelming, like trying to be like, Oh, I want to do this and this and this and this, and then you end up maybe not doing anything well, you know, as if you had like a couple of things that you really implemented well, then then that's maybe be it more successful.

Beth

And I think it's about also don't make excuses about why you can't implement something like don't pick the three easiest things that you think you can do, like pick one that's challenging. And I had all the all the people in the marketing room shout, I am limitless on purpose because so many times we like put ourselves in a box and think, Well, I can't do that because of X, Y, Z, and I can't do that in my organization because we don't have this or I don't have this.

Beth

And it's like, no, pick something that's a challenge and really hone in on it and try it and fail if you need to. But it, you know, like sometimes failing is just as good of an experience than actually being super successful on it.

Julie

And that's part of the magic of Summit, is those connections. You're there with other people who are passionate about it and you can talk to it. And so I think people need to remember to foster connections outside of something like Summit. So whether that's somebody you've met in a similar role for somewhere else, you have a zoom once a month to talk about challenges you had.

Julie

If that means taking somebody on your team out to coffee, you know, once every two weeks to like talk through things and brainstorm like outside. I think fostering the connections is one way to kind of keep that.

Jen

Spark.

Beth

Absolutely.

Jen

Lit. Hey, you got to get you got to get acclimated, you got to accelerate, you got to stay lit and you got to dominate, dominate. You're going to add that and the guy's never going to.

Julie

Do a podcast together again. They're going to say, we've lost control.

Beth

You know, the persona that Jen just took on was Love it. I hope everyone who's listening goes back and watches just that.

Jen

This is like recorded. Okay, So.

Julie

You thought you were just hanging.

Jen

Out.

Beth

You need to make one of your freestyle raps next. Actually, that puts all.

Jen

That in it. You know, I need to work on this. You're right.

Beth

Challenge accepted. Julie, what do you got?

Julie

Yeah, so I was talking to a builder yesterday. She is new in the role, but not new to home building. Super smart, working hard. And she came to me and said, I'm freaking out because everybody's on me. Like, not enough leads. Not enough leads. We don't have enough. Everything slow. And I was like, okay, let's look at the numbers.

Julie

And then when we pulled all the numbers, number wise, like things look good, you know, we are getting what we were when they felt like things are real. So we're just talking through like, let's take the data. How are we going to talk through the data with them? How are we going to ask a questions about like, why does this feel flow with this?

Julie

And she said something that I thought was really might resonate with other people. She said, it's like learning a language. She said when we talk about it, she was like, I understand it. I get it. When I'm at Summit and I'm learning these things, I'm like, Yes, But she said then, like leadership or sales or somebody comes to me with these things, with these questions and I have to talk about like, what we're doing is marketing.

Julie

She's like, Then I can't just communicate it out to them. I can't take that and explain it. And so we just had this conversation about how that in itself is a skill. One thing is like understanding the numbers and knowing what you're doing and having a marketing strategy. That's a separate skill to then be able to take all that data and look at that information and then be able to communicate that back to other people in the organization.

Julie

And I said, That's just going to take practice and that's something you're actually going to have to work at. You're going to have to be in the data every day. You're going to have to start showing this to people and explaining things to people and getting that experience of how you talk about it and how to answer things.

Julie

So that was interesting thinking about it like that as a language. She understands it, but she can't speak it yet. Know that's that's her challenge right now. And I think that's it is a harder skill than people realize. They just think they should be able to do it automatically. But it takes practice.

Beth

That is such good advice and link telling her to get out there and and try and talk to different audiences because how you translate it and how you tell that story of the data is going to be a little bit different based off of the audience that you're presenting it to. And so the more you do that, the more comfortable and confident that you'll be.

Beth

And I think it translates in any any position, not just marketers translating data, but online salespeople overcoming objections on the phone, us as coaches, all three of us being coaches and like trying to get, you know, make an impact with different types of people and in different organizations like it, Give yourself some grace. Start from the foundation that you have, build upon that foundation and get practice.

Beth

So that way it just feels more comfortable and intuitive over time. But that grace is so important. And then advice you gave her so good.

Jen

You know, and into like as you were talking, I was thinking about so my daughter Mia just came home for fall break from school and I was asking her about her classes and she was like, Oh, I had this presentation. I had to stand up in front of people and I got to 96 and like, I didn't even have to really look at my notes.

Jen

And I just felt so good about it. And I was like, Oh, you know, that's so great. Mia, why do you think? And she's like, Well, I really knew the material. And I said, Ding, ding, ding. Like, the more with knowledge comes confidence. Yes, the more that you study and you prepare and you learn it, the more confident you're going to feel about what you're talking about.

Jen

And you don't even need it like it just comes authentically out of you, you know, to talk about that as coaches, you know, it's like, yeah, you don't even need to look at a script. Like you feel confident about the knowledge you can present it. So you're marketers. It's like, yeah, you have to put in the work to learn it and study it, right?

Jen

But it takes time and have some cheat sheet. Like if you're going to be presenting to leadership, like have your notes like because you get sidetracked and you forget what you're talking about and have your notes and your T sheets. Yeah.

Beth

And focus on the things that will be most important to them. Like, you don't have to dig into the weeds, you don't have to be super technical and we don't have to let our entire nerdy like, nerd side show like, we can talk it in a little bit.

Jen

Let your nerd flag fly. Yeah.

Beth

To an extent.

Jen

To an extent, Yes.

Julie

Yes. Consider your audience for a show.

Jen

Hey, ladies, I'm just so happy at you all. Because sometimes Kevin and Andrew are on here, and I'm sitting here like, Okay, yeah, I had no idea what you're talking about. I'm over here in online sales land. Don't know. So they're doling out red flag five to high as what you're saying. Make sure that you're somewhat understandable by the normal people like me when we're coming.

Beth

Into the first thing that I wasn't as strong at as a lot of the technical side of ads because I didn't have to do a lot of that at my builder. Oh, yeah. You know, so like when Andrew and Julie and Becca and Sarah were teaching me the things that I needed to rebuild my foundation on, I would be like, Okay, for Dummies, like, do this for Dummies.

Beth

And oh, sister, we all have our strengths. We all have other things that we're good at. But not everyone. And my husband, I know he's listening. He always listens. He always says to me like, Oh.

Jen

That makes one of ours.

Julie

Mine doesn't.

Jen

Either, but I don't.

Julie

Listen to his. So it's fair.

Jen

Where even semblance of like.

Beth

Well, he has all this time on his drive in the morning. So he listens to our voices. But he always reminds me like, not everyone knows what you what you know, you know, it's not a natural. So, like, sometimes you have to dumb it down a little bit and pretend like you're writing Marketing for Dummies or things like that.

Beth

And it's not a bad thing. It's a good thing because it also it brings us to keep going back to this foundation. It brings us back to our foundation and kind of helps us remember on the basics that we should be focusing on every right while.

Jen

Yeah, yeah. And I think it's okay to be vulnerable when you don't know something. So like, yes, I mean, this is yeah, this is about.

Beth

This is a big topic.

Jen

And I think one.

Beth

I think it's a really good topic for everyone listening, but especially leaders that are listening because I don't think and I, I think that's why so many people at Summit were so captivated by Rhonda and Elaina because they are high level within their organizations. But they and even Chris, you know, like not afraid to be vulnerable and let people in because it it opens up the door for other people to be vulnerable.

Beth

And it doesn't mean that you have to be singing Kumbaya and like diving into your personal lives. It just means that you are unafraid to be authentically yourself, to be wrong, to fail, and to allow room for people to not know so they can ask the right questions so that you can actually get to the right answers.

Jen

Yeah, I know I've talked about this before, probably on the podcast, and I'm just going to say it again. Rene Brown talks about daring leadership versus armored leader in leadership. Armored leadership means you approach things with like, I know everything. Like I don't want to ever look vulnerable, Like I'm tough, tough, tough, right? Yeah. When you approach leadership in that way, you you're missing out on growth and opportunity, approaching it with a daring leadership mindset.

Jen

You know, I'll admit, like I don't know. I don't know the answer to that. But you know what? You and I are going to figure this out together. Yeah, I'm going to ask questions of you. You're going to teach me. I'm going to teach you, and we're going to tackle this together, you know? So I just encourage leaders like and even us, do you convert as coaches like and it's like sometimes you don't know the answer and it's okay to be like I was just on a call yesterday, totally stumped me.

Jen

I was like, So I gave up my classic, you know, and those of you that know this. So this is the classic pivot objection is like, Hmm, that's interesting. I'm not 100% sure I'm going to take it back and talk about it with the team and we'll get back to you. But I don't know, calling in a lifeline.

Beth

Like if you don't do that as a leader, then you are also preventing your own growth because you just stop learning.

Jen

That's what I mean. Exactly. You stop learning.

Julie

Yeah. And your whole team is scared to admit when they don't know something, right? Because you look like you always have the answers and I'm going to look stupid. But if they know you're willing to do that, then they're willing to admit when, like, I don't know what that means. I'm just shaking, rattling, vibrating.

Jen

And like, Yes, and that and I know exactly what you're talking about. Good for. Oh, okay. That's not Gatorade. Okay, cool. Got it. Yeah.

Beth

No, I think this is a this is the big topic as of recently. And I can't tell you actually how many times that somewhat summit it was brought up to me. And I don't know if either of you got the same of like people wanting more leadership help, whether it be at the marketing level or the sales and marketing level.

Beth

And so it's something that, you know, I've been really brewing on and I'm trying to create a way for that fire to keep burning because I think it's really important that we continue training at that level and at that topic because it as we're learning from the stuff that's in the news this week that.

Jen

Said, Oh, we got into this, we got to talk to we got to talk about the news, I guess it's like, hey, we'll get there. But it.

Beth

Can it can have a really big domino effect within an.

Jen

Organization. 100% agree with you on the online sales side. But leadership is a constant. Like just managing online sales team is completely different than managing an on site. So a completely different and so, you know, most sales leaders bandwidth is stretched. They're busy. They're putting out fires with on site stuff all the time. And if numbers look good, it's easy just to go, Hey, you go over their numbers like, fine, okay, check suite, everything's good.

Jen

Yeah, but what we know is that, yeah, the numbers look great because numbers look great right now, like as far as conversions go. But we have to look beyond that and we have to manage the program, manage the person, you know, beyond just the numbers. So there's definitely a space for more conversations around it.

Beth

Though. I promise we'll get to the news, but I want to do a hot take if that's okay with you. Girl. Is that.

Jen

Yeah.

Beth

Then. And Julie too. Who do you think should manage online sales within an organization?

Jen

Oh, well, I'll let Julie answer first and then I'll answer.

Julie

Oh, gosh. To do a marketing marketing director, this would be my first answer. Okay. That's my experience. That's my experience. It started in marketing. Then it was director of sales and marketing was the same person. So I lean towards marketing, not sales.

Jen

Okay, so I have J I have a not an exactly black and white answer. If it is a new program for your organization and you have to get sales buy in, like it's a complete culture shift when you're rolling this program out and sales could be a little bit resistant to it. Mm hmm. It works well to have a sales leader kind of overseeing because online sales is an extension of the sales team.

Jen

That's how you want to set that role up and position. And so if you have a sales leader over it that's really good at bridging the gap, then it works out better. I think in that situation. Ultimately, the bottom line though, is whoever is going to have the bandwidth, whoever understands the role, the best, who is going to hold them accountable, who is going to be the conduit between sales and marketing and online, which in a lot of cases it's marketing, right?

Jen

We talk about online sales being like the lovechild between marketing and sales. And so we see a lot of success too, with online sales reporting up to that marketing person. And that is kind of really good. But ultimately it comes down to there has to be communication between sales, marketing and online. If, if there's silos and it never works.

Beth

Yeah, no, I think that's a really good answer. And like originally I would isolate on Julie side too, based off of my own personal experience. Right?

Julie

And we're marketers because.

Jen

You, you, you manage, you manage the team and your marketing.

Beth

So and they came from sales to under the marketing umbrella in that room. But the reason why that worked to your point, Jen, is because I had the time and ability to understand their role within the organization and the impact which they had within the organization and our successes. And so it made sense for them to be under me within the marketing umbrella.

Beth

Right. And I think that's what the same situation for Julie as well. I don't want to speak on her behalf, but I think that was that was similar for you guys. And so when it comes to online sales, I think, yeah, they could flourish under either, but it's just important that their voice is heard and recognized and appreciated within the organizations that they are fully supported by whomever it is that is leading them.

Beth

But it has to have the influence of marketing and sales either way.

Julie

And it's not like sells if a sell is if a sales person is going to be the leader, not a sales person, a sales leader is going to manage them. I think they have to understand how dramatically different those two roles are. They can't treat them like a on site salesperson just taking. It's a different it's a different role.

Julie

So it has to be somebody who understands that those differences, I think.

Jen

Yeah.

Beth

That can be said for marketing, right? Because like if you have a sales leader in charge of marketing or leading the marketing person, whoever is doing the implementation of marketing, if you have, it's someone that doesn't understand marketing or doesn't recognize the difference between marketing and sales and how they should work together, not separately, then you're setting them up for failure as well.

Beth

So basically, if you're at the top, if you're in a leadership position in any organization, in any field, you have to take the time to understand what it is that your people do and their importance within the day in and day out operations and the success of the operation in order to be a successful leader at that level.

Jen

And this goes back to what we were saying about daring and armored leadership. If you are a leader. Hill, you're like, I've never been an online sales specialist. I have no idea like the ins and outs, right? Because it's at a time like you weren't an online sales specialist and you manage them, right? Huh? Being a daring leader is now.

Jen

I've never done this role. Teach me, you know, show me, show me your process. Show me what you do. Show me your reporting. Show me those and let's talk about it now. You don't have to come in and like, knowing everything or, you know, to me.

Beth

Biggest question. Just be the expert.

Jen

Yeah, just ask questions.

Julie

Yeah. I'll circle your ticket full circle.

Jen

In that manner.

Beth

So they should let us take over more of that.

Beth

Okay. So I promise we will get to the news. So all of this does lead in to the hot topic of the week, which is Redfin's announcement via an open letter, if you will, on what was it Monday that they published this?

Jen

It was Monday.

Beth

Yeah. That they are leaving the National Association of Realtors and they really put it all out there, which I mean kudos because I love the, the honesty, I love the transparency.

Jen

Currency things.

Beth

And I think, you know, we've had a couple internal conversations about this. But I think the the real interesting thing about this is to see what happens next, because they're the first ones to really say now, like regardless of how the semantics work behind the scenes and what might happen, what they can and can't do at different levels and in different regional areas, you know, where their hands might be a little cuffed, if you will.

Beth

But I think it's really interesting that they were the first ones to take it out there and say, we're not tolerating this anymore and something has to change.

Julie

And if you're not following this, the few reasons they gave for severing ties was one, the Association of Realtors policies requiring a fee for the buyer's agent on every listing. So and that meant like on redfin.com you couldn't list a for sale by owner. It would have to be someone associated and then also a pattern of alleged sexual harassment.

Julie

So there were there were different levels to this. It wasn't just the policies that they're unhappy with, it was also some leadership issues as well. So it's a very layered, multifaceted issue that they're working through and they.

Jen

Realtor Right. As a former member of and they are a no, I like it.

Julie

Yeah. And it really it gets more complicated. It gets complicated because a lot of the MLS is, are tied to the local and state realtor association. So you have to be a member of the Association of Realtors to get access to the MLS. Yeah, well, the in air rules say that if they're not associating with that, none of their none of the people below them down stream, which would give them no access to MLS.

Julie

So it's a very far reaching they've said this and there's different conversations about is this just symbolic or are they going to go fight every single, you know, different local chapter? I don't know if they're chapters, whatever they are, to get access to the MLS. So it's very much the first step. It's a big step and it makes a big statement in a very long process of how to untangle all of this that's been going on, how it's worked.

Jen

In pairs, then going, Hmm, there's been a ruckus around this for quite some time. So like you said, I'll be interesting to see kind of what happens next, like being the first ones to kind of publicly put it out there.

Beth

So, yeah, beautifully summarized. Really. That was.

Jen

That was.

Beth

Kudos, man. I know what.

Jen

You're talking about, Julie. Thank you.

Julie

Hopefully it's all right. You'll go read the article and double check all the facts there.

Jen

I read the links in the show notes.

Beth

So in our next piece of news is also related to the National Association of Man Hours.

Jen

Because.

Beth

Apparently there is I love this word mutiny inside the air. I get.

Jen

My popcorn.

Beth

Yeah, seriously, let me start popping in right now as staffers call for resignation of top executives. Now, this is more based around the sexual harassment claims that have occurred, as well as additional toxic workplace environment situations and cover ups and yeah, there's that's going to take a big bag of popcorn.

Jen

Yeah, I think we're just moving on from this.

Beth

Yeah, just I think I think it shows a little bit of the ripple effect right now. If Yeah, back up it's back in the news. Now they are they're saying it's only a small number of employee employees that issued this letter, but I think it's still a big step and I think it shows that people aren't going to, like I said earlier, tolerate it anymore and people are willing to put their name on the line in some cases and their job and their their careers to say even within their company with Redfin's case, to say that, okay, like something has to get something has to be done.

Beth

So let's see how it pans out.

Julie

Yeah, I'm sure we'll be talking about this more.

Jen

Yeah. In the future.

Beth

Hopefully not as long as mortgage rates.

Julie

Oh, gosh. No mortgage rate stories this week.

Jen

No, no, no.

Beth

But this next one, Julie has a good personal story associated with it. I know, I know. But yeah.

Jen

So I guess.

Julie

Climate change pushes up home insurance premiums. A recent study from policy genius found that quoted homeowners insurance premiums increased by 21% nationally from May 2022 to May 2023, and that Florida experienced the largest jump with premiums increasing by 35%. So I went and did the math. So I live in Louisiana, south Louisiana, just north of New Orleans, and everybody below Interstate 12, all their insurance premiums have gone crazy.

Julie

So my insurance company, who we had homeowner's insurance for a year, went bankrupt. So I got a letter that said they're going bankrupt. You're about to not have homeowner's insurance. And here we found another quote for you, which nobody wants to give homeowner's insurance down here. And it the new quote they gave me was 174% higher than we were currently paying.

Julie

This is in March. Oh, boy. Stressed out in March. And it was a great like an insurance company. I had never heard of. We don't even live in a flood plain or I mean, all of all of this area is probably the same. But we're not we're not required to have flood insurance.

Jen

When I was there, what was the rate like? Why?

Julie

Well, they went bankrupt and just nobody wants to take on people in this area. They just say, no, thank you. Most homeowners in church, this is so the quote we got was from like a crazy sounding made up name insurance company. And when I talked to another agent, he said, oh, and I've heard that they asked you to sign over a power of attorney if you work with them.

Julie

I'm like, well, I'm not doing that. So they finally found me another one, and my premium went up 109%, which was better than the 174%. So when I read this article.

Jen

I got a little.

Julie

But how it affects not just my story, but just how it affects homeowners like that digs right into your budget for how much or how much money you have to pay for your monthly mortgage. I mean, it makes a big difference, especially Florida, Louisiana, I'm sure, areas of Texas. I don't know, John, if this affects you or. Yeah.

Jen

Well, it does, because I am below sea level. Mm hmm.

Julie

For right there with you. Think we're really close? Yeah.

Jen

Yeah. So you have requirements for flood insurance. Anybody that's buying a new home. So this is interesting. Right down. Down the way people that live directly on the river. Yeah. Norfolk, which is really low. If you buy a home over there, as of, I think maybe last year or the year before, you're required to raise it in order to get the insurance.

Jen

So you have to like so we see all these homes going up on like built stilts, basically, I don't know, like cinderblock foundations, like ten feet high. It's like the most bizarre thing. But it's like in order to get insurance you at that's the requirement is that you have to raise your house.

Julie

And what the article saying is people are now taking this into account when they're purchasing homes. You know, I mean, if I was buying another home, I would think about it like, can we get. But of course it affects school district and all sorts of things. But it does and it's something worth talking about. If you're in an area where the the home insurance premiums are more affordable than just a little bit down the road, I mean, it's things worth thinking about because this is what homebuyers are thinking about as well.

Jen

Yeah, I was.

Beth

Gonna say.

Jen

Using that as a Yeah, you're saying using that as a unique selling proposition of Yeah. Hey, compared to this.

Beth

It works because in your neighborhood alone aren't it a huge master planned community that we live in our side. We actually didn't know this until we were prepping to close, but we are required to have flood insurance and no one warned me how expensive it is.

Jen

Right?

Beth

Oh, okay. But that being said, the other side of the neighborhood, there's a street that like when you're driving and it's first on your right hand side, Their biggest selling point is they don't require flood insurance over there. So when people lose their homes, they're like, not only are we in River Island, but oh, by the way, you don't need flood insurance here.

Beth

And it's a huge selling point. So I feel like we need to marketers need to be paying attention to little nuances like that because it does affect affordability and it does affect the buyers decision making.

Julie

Yeah, and you need to be listening to your home buyers for anything like that that they're talking about because if that matters to them, it needs to matter to you as well.

Jen

Amen. Yeah.

Beth

Speaking of affordability and impact on that, we have resumed student loan payments, shake up the housing market from pro builder. Yeah.

Jen

So that alone gives me gives me stress.

Beth

I can see out you're in you're wiggling a lot right now trying to shake it out.

Jen

Now I have one with student loans, so.

Beth

Yeah. Yeah. I don't, I can't, I can't speak to this one personal experience because neither of us had student loans. We were very blessed to not have any. But basically, student loan payments are set to resume this month and that added expense is an unwelcome obstacle for already cost burden homebuyers. So I'm just another factor that we have to we have to consider when talking to our homeowners are soon to be homeowners of what they can realistically afford.

Beth

Because now what I liked about this one is they're talking about how consumers are essentially bundling their debt. And so they're looking at their debt as a whole number versus like something have been paid off here. They're, you know, and not individual numbers. Exactly. So they're looking at this as a holistic number. And so that payment is just adding to that whole number.

Beth

And that's they're feeling that anxiety going into the purchase because it's not just the mortgage that they're considering. They're considering the student debt, they're considering the car payments that are through the roof right now. Our student.

Jen

Loan monthly payment is.

Beth

So this article said it's.

Jen

In the artery filled day with something. I feel like I read something or it was like 203 or something in.

Julie

This article says Typical monthly student loan payment being around $200.

Jen

Okay. Yeah.

Julie

And the other thing that plays into we just talked to a builder today and we were talking about some different things different builders are doing and they were like, Yeah, but you have to understand our particular buyer, they don't have a 20% down payment and that's going to be an issue too, as all these things eat into people's budgets like that.

Julie

Down payment is more and more of an issue too. So as far reaching effects for us, I feel like.

Beth

Yeah, absolutely. It's really it's interesting that a lot of builders don't even know that about their buyer like courtesy your builder knowing that because sometimes they don't understand the nuances.

Jen

Like.

Beth

And I love that they're out there actively trying to learn like I get a lot of builders within our circle asking for a 30 minute call with me to learn about the military buyer and what that psyche is like and how they can help them in a different way. That's outside of some sort of incentive. And I love having those conversations because they are truly making an effort.

Beth

And I think all of these articles and the realistic world that we're living in right now is pinpointing that we have to take that 1 to 1 approach and really know what our buyer's life is like and the obstacles that they have outside of just our day to day organization and the products that we have to offer them within our community, but really take the time to learn who they are and what their what their face.

Jen

Personalized incentives based on what's happening with that particular customer or buyer. So, oh, you have student loan debt. So should the builder pay their student loan? Well, that's a stretch.

Julie

But this is Jen's take now.

Jen

Oh, pay.

Beth

That off for you.

Jen

Student loans are preventing you from getting into this house. What if we paid half of your student loan debt? I don't know. I'm just like.

Beth

I mean, is it less than what they would pay some $10,000 and $10,000? So I'm.

Jen

Saying like, you know, if you want to use that to pay to reduce your debt to income ratio, I don't know, like because from what I know, because I have a kid who has student loans, like the loan amount is, you know, it's spread to keep the loan to keep the monthly payment low. Right. Like paying this high interest rate, it's spread over a long period of time when really it might only be $20,000 that they owe.

Jen

But like in to make that an affordable payment. Right. They've got this crazy loan thing and whatever. So if if a builder could say, well, pay your loan off or we'll pay half your loan off, I don't know that when this happens.

Julie

Jen, you're getting full credit for this. I love it. Let's get.

Jen

In.

Julie

Special love.

Jen

It's thrown.

Beth

It's a great example of like the amount of creativity that we have to have right now on a 1 to 1 basis. Like, yes, the conversations that I had with a builder recently about like, how can we help the military buyer or even just the reload buyer in general, Like take our situation as a case study. We lived in an Airbnb for two.

Jen

Months that.

Beth

Was $5,000. Pay for their Airbnb for two months.

Jen

Yes, yes, we will help you with your moving costs, your relocation cost, whatever, will you know? Yes. Listen, when when I was in my former life, I mean, I worked for builders that would like, okay, like your homes, I can be ready for another six months longer than what we thought or whatever we'll pay for you for a long term rental.

Jen

Yeah, a furnished rental. Yeah. Like, you know, and I don't know, I just. I agree with you that there has to be more some creative solutions and to work with some of these people. Yeah.

Beth

Yeah, absolutely. And as marketers, like, we have the you have a voice in offering those solutions up like you have a voice and an impact. And don't be afraid to make those suggestions and say, Hey, I heard this creative idea or this other builder is doing this. Maybe this is something that we can implement. And I love that idea because people forget and builders forget that at the time of purchasing and moving a home, not only is it extremely stressful, but you are hemorrhaging money when you are purchasing a home, whether it be because you have to do an Airbnb or you have to pay the movers or have to tip them, you have to

Beth

buy the movers food, you have to get out of your lease early, you have to sell your home, you have to move across country and pay for hotels. You have to buy new furniture like you are hemorrhaging money left and right for whatever reason. And so the the different ways that you can relieve some of that burden.

Jen

Off.

Beth

In creative ways that you can do that. I mean, let's see it happen.

Jen

You can you can tell that's just me, mood. I know this is I got it.

Jen

You got to get them food.

Beth

And how many times have we moved.

Jen

In the guy to go buy toilet paper? I mean.

Beth

Your food goes bad. You have to fight rid of all of your food in your in. Like, it's ridiculous. The little things that you don't think about.

Jen

You need to unpack.

Beth

These always turn into a therapy session for me. Okay.

Jen

I love it. It's good. Oh, my gosh.

Beth

Okay. Speaking of waiting, I'm. I'm moving right on this thing and waiting for a long time. Why is your Starbucks wait so long, Julie?

Julie

It's because people are coming up with weirder and weirder drinks, more elaborate drink combinations.

Jen

As long as you got to wait for perfection.

Julie

So this is from customization. Bloomberg And it says elaborate drinks and an almost endless array of combinations can slow baristas down. But a plan to hasten service has yet to materialize. So they're talking about how it's how Starbucks is struggling because there are so many There was like a crazy number in here. If I can find it for like just a latte, it adds up to more than 383 billion different possibilities of what you can make.

Julie

The team had a lot of fun with this one. There was a lot of back and forth conversation about this.

Jen

Article.

Beth

We did, and while the different data that was pulled, I is really fun and I don't remember particularly if it was in this article or not, but we talked about it internally. But Starbucks had released that they that their customizations, their personalization of their product, if you will, increases their revenue by 1 billion. But on the contrary, their other data, which is the weight associated with creating said custom drinks, had lost them anywhere between three and 5 billion or something like that in additional revenue because people were leaving and they were losing.

Jen

Like, I don't have time to wait.

Beth

Oh Jen, how does that relate to online sales?

Jen

Yeah, well, yeah, if, if you're not first or last. So yeah, listen, people, you know, go back to that that study both you and I were talking about, like the personalization study, bomb bomb had presented it last year at our summit and just talking about one customers expect. So that word to expect is very powerful here. As we're talking about this, customers expect personalized service.

Jen

They they want what they want. They want customization, they want personalization, and they want it quick. And so if we're not able to deliver that, we're going to lose case in point, like, yes, they're making money on their personalization, but they're losing more on people getting irritated and walking out the door. So when we talk about online sales, we got a staff up, we got a staff up in order to meet the demands, in order to provide a personalized service.

Jen

So Starbucks, you know, they're making changes. They're talking about getting different ice. It's like what they need to do. They need to staff up if they're going to be able to provide this level of service.

Julie

The other place I've seen this in home building. So I've been I'm old. I've been in home building since before 2008. I started in 2005 Production Builder. And it's like this is what we build.

Jen

We started to.

Julie

Hear.

Jen

Is it? Yes.

Julie

Here's what we build. You can select from these two color palettes and people were fine with that and then 2008 hit and everything crashed. And we said, you can make whatever.

Jen

You want, hear all the.

Julie

Selections in the world. So like the pendulum swung the exact way. Then we started not being profitable on that and it was taking everybody forever to get through the system. There were way too many choices. It was overwhelming. Everybody. And we swung all the way the other way where at one point that Idol Homes stable, call me if I'm wrong on this, but at one time I told Homes somebody would say, I will buy that house if you will paint the front door.

Julie

I think once we painted a front door orange and we live in Norman with you and somebody is like, you have to paint the front door. And we would refuse. We would say, Nope, that's not our scope. If that door is orange, it's staying orange. So like, I think what's interesting, what I've seen in homebuilding is how in the selections world, like that pendulum goes dramatic either way.

Jen

Yep.

Julie

And I think where probably Starbucks suffers with they're so huge it's hard to quickly adapt to changes. So if there's a Tik Tok trend and this is from Olivia and Bryce, they had these this conversation on the Slack channel. They were talking about how all the sudden on Tik Tok people are talking about the cool new trend of this weird drink that had 42 different things in it.

Julie

You know, it's hard. Then everybody goes and orders that like how do you do that among all the Starbucks in the world slows everything down. So yeah, we definitely see this. And I think the people who deal with it best probably are the people who are faster to adapt.

Beth

Yeah.

Jen

You think Absolutely set expectations a little differently at the beginning. And when you go to order and balance out, yeah, you set expectations and then you don't have an issue.

Julie

I mean, I think it's.

Beth

About living and like we talked about this at our, at the summit for the on the marketing side, my session was on personalization and then taking ideas out of other industries that do it well. And the whole point is that it's somewhere in the middle, like you have to offer enough that you're meeting your buyers expectations of allowing customization or a personalized experience.

Beth

But you're also living in a world where you can still mass produce something, whether it be a shoe, M&Ms, Starbucks drinks or homes. I going to say mass produce that in that regard, but, you know, produce a product in an efficient manner that can be delivered on time. So it's just living in that middle ground. And sometimes it doesn't have to be a huge thing, like a bajillion options for a custom drink.

Beth

It can be something a little bit dial back where the customer just needs to feel control. They need to feel like they had a part in the process. They got what they wanted. Their expectations were met and it's up to us to find what that middle ground is, that sweet spot so that we can work effectively or efficiently in this case to be successful.

Jen

Now lessens. We've solved all the problems today.

Julie

Solve problems to solve.

00:51:00:16 - 00:51:02:13

Jen

So fun, girls, we.

Julie

Got all we got to have a girls only podcast every now and again. We got a that's on the schedule.

Jen

100%.

Beth

I'm down. Put it on. Olivia. I hear you listening in. Okay, so before we end, we have to do our favorite favorites.

Julie

I do have a favorite.

Jen

Oh, my.

Julie

Gosh. So I just found on Netflix there is a new season of my very favorite show, which is Great British Baking Show. I do not.

Jen

Bake.

Julie

Do not bake. I love it. It's my favorite. And there's a new season out and it.

Jen

Just made my day. Do you actually bake or do. I don't watch it because it's soothing.

Beth

I the dry humor is everything.

Julie

It relaxes me. The British accent was relaxed me. But I just it's my favorite. I would I have watched these episodes. It's one of those ones I'll put on in the background and just let play because it's very soothing to me. So I'm very excited about that. That is my my favorite Right now.

Beth

I'm learning more about you. I like this.

Jen

Wow. This is my favorite show right now. It suits me.

Beth

Oh, it had you having a resurgence.

Jen

I know. Yeah. You know, it's bad when my 75 year old mom tells me about it, she's like, Oh, have you seen this new show? Suits? It's so funny and cute. You would really like it. I was like, okay, so I start watching it. I'm hooked. Yeah.

Beth

It's addicting. So if you haven't watched.

Jen

It, you guys watch it?

Julie

No, I'm too busy watching.

Jen

Your acting for this. Baking show.

Ju