Ace - A Master of Movement - Noise of the Broke Boys - Episode 003
BBoy Ace, a west coast pioneer in Hip Hop, sits down to discuss his origins, work ethic, and thoughts on the culture of hip hop and breakin'.
Follow @
Instagram: noiseofthebrokeboys
Twitter: BrokeBoysNoise
Listen to the Audio on all Podcast platforms.
All The Links Here: https://linktr.ee/NoiseOfTheBrokeBoys
A broke degenerate hooligan documents conversations about being a Bboy, Breakin', Hip Hop, Dance, Art, Music, Creativity, Innovation, and the slow subtle crumble of society in audio form.
----more----
[Music]
this episode of noise of the broke boys
is brought to you by outside have you
developed a fear of the Sun because you
stay inside all day commenting on
YouTube videos or maybe you've developed
an addiction to posting about how
awesome your life is on social media
between your day job as an overpriced
thrift store clothes model and side
hustle selling your new rap mixtape talk
to your doctor to see if outside is
right for you five out of five people
that have tried going outside have seen
positive results ranging from but not
limited to talking to actual people
feeling Sun on their skin moving their
bodies and not caring about the latest
celebrity gossip happiness is just
around the corner and through a door
talk to your doctor about going outside
some participants going outside
sufferance of your injuries and even
death from but not limited to hit by bus
coronavirus being eaten by wolves
the Californio them from tencel are
killing and kidnapped by terrace and now
onto the show
[Music]
in today's episode I talked to the West
Coast pioneer innovator and frankly
legendary b-boy and hip-hop figure my
friend and influence b-boy ace please
enjoy the episode hello everybody
welcome to the show today I have the man
the myth the legend the teacher the
pioneer the father the fiance future
husband and b-boy he's been dancing
since the beginning of time so very long
time 91 yeah how long since 1991 1991
well man you know what's interesting is
that I was talking to someone recently
was that breaking kind of started around
like mid 70s right is that about what
you think yeah that's that's at least
what I've heard so you've been breaking
for probably more than half of the
lifetime of hip-hop that's like really
crazy to even think of that it's such a
young dance such a young culture that in
a hundred years when it's still around
people are gonna look back and go like
what was happening in the beginning
because it was like there's so much
fluctuation in and that this era right
here is like really what helped kind of
define it to be whatever it ends up
becoming well the thing that's
interesting to me now is because there's
been absent flows to where it starts top
starts stops but from 91 on it's been
consistent mhm it's been going there's
there's been no stop yeah so it's gained
as MoMA as much momentum as there's ever
been and it's been a consistent thing so
since this time that that I began you
know and there were some started you
know who it was going a little
before I started but it's you know many
have stopped but the whole thing is kept
going so that that's a beautiful part of
pop that yeah yeah yeah
for me you know I got started I had no
interest in dance I didn't start
originally as a b-boy interesting I
originally started as a house dancer
West Coast Oh a West Coast house yeah
which is different from the house that
house now yeah yeah that that is known
it's like a mixture of New Jack with a
lot more yeah upper body movement I see
so you know there was there was New Jack
and like that was fun mm-hmm
but for me I didn't really have an
interest in doing that my brother was a
really good at New Jack he was little
yeah and he tried to show me and I
couldn't do it like a lot like you know
like I struggled even with something
that was less complicated okay but I
didn't have an interest in it so I was
like I'm cool on it yeah no big deal
I want no part of it then the person who
ended up being my teacher I and crazily
you know it's crazy to say but to this
day one of the greatest dancers I've
ever seen
Aaron L Coloma Oh from Palm Springs okay
he was a house dancer yeah he used to
pop when he was little and he went into
New Jack and then he went into house and
super talented and he saw my brother who
was really good at New Jack and he
wanted to teach little kids to be to be
great house dancers yeah yeah yeah so
his intent was to teach my brother and
so that's how I met him and I brought
him to my house to teach my brother yeah
and while he was waiting for my brother
he was just moving and that was the
craziest thing I ever saw yeah life like
it was literally like poetry in motion
hmm I was tripping how old are you at
that time oka hot 16 some along those
lines I believe I was a sophomore in
high school okay second half and I saw
him move and I just couldn't believe
that somebody can move like that yeah
like I had never really seen anything
like that and seeing it in person is a
completely different experience hmm
so I was bugged out and I just kind of
knew that that's what I wanted to do
that's cool yeah it was it was harassed
him I literally harassed him for a
couple weeks thank you to teach me
Wow and he wouldn't because he told me
he said do you understand like you can't
do new jack
and that's like basic arithmetic yeah
house is far more complicated so it's
kind of like doing pre-algebra yeah yeah
he's like you want to jump steps you
want to go straight to precalculus yeah
algebra whatever it is without even
knowing basic arrhythmia don't even know
how a plus sign yeah you can't even just
make your lower body coordinate much
less upper body and lower body
synchronized beautiful movements okay
but I was undeterred okay it was I saw
it and from there like I just knew I had
to have it okay and so I just kept after
it yep I kept bugging him and finally
one day all right all right
I'm gonna teach you one step you're
gonna learn that step and then you come
to me with that step and I'm gonna teach
you another step and I was like deal
okay deal that's a good deal yeah
but I had to work for that one step yeah
yeah and but he but he realized I was
not going to stop mm-hm and
from there it was a rap I I was 24/7
with it
wake up move act is practicing try and
trying to coordinate this uncoordinated
body of mine yeah
dirt at school during nutrition during
lunch after school at practice at his
house before bed it was crazy I was a
maniac
yeah I was a maniac but I wanted to be I
wanted to move like he moved and I knew
I was far off I was I was not you know I
was realistic about where I was at him
where he was at but I wanted to get
there
yes quick as possible so I was 24/7 with
it soothing yeah to the point where he
literally had to pull me aside at some
point and tell me that you know your
mother your mother misses you yeah yeah
yeah yeah love that love your
determination but you gotta sleep
sometimes the guys are getting a little
a little annoyed that you'd never stop
yeah and I was hurt I was hurt yeah like
I literally avoided didn't see him for a
while taking different routes to class
really yeah yeah yeah and literally was
that like after a week we cross paths
and he kind of cut me off and was like a
man like where you been like and he's
like don't take it that way you know
like we're not saying stop you know the
guys you know just just take a couple
breathe you know like breathe for ya you
know but yeah it's so that began my long
journey at the beginning I was getting
pretty good at house you know after a
good little while
and then we went up to an event called
Filipino weekend up in Delano just past
Bakersfield
yeah and that's you know the the group
we were with was boys and style bis and
so we were going up there and you know
we were going to meet with the rest of
the group and we're under the assumption
that a group the soul brothers which is
famous house moved from LA we're gonna
be there and you know wanted to battle
them yeah yeah and they end up never end
up showing up our cuz one of the crew
members cousins from San Jose a group
called dangerous image came down and
like they were gonna be with us yeah and
they were a choreography group okay
that also braked because San Jose was
big into braking amount of time and we
all got bored and somehow it ended up
being a battle between dangerous image
oh and you guys and B is okay except for
they braked him we didn't so you know
they were they were really good yeah and
that the main guy from their group was a
walks guy mm-hmm
this guy Alan hmm and he did walks even
he was really good he not
merry-go-rounds and all that but he had
really good walks yeah yeah hence the
inspiration yeah when we started the
very next day we stopped Houston and we
be started breaking is that quick it was
an instant like - it was like watching
magic you know like really that the
power precision grace of you know
high-level break-in yeah it was like wow
like okay that that that is you know it
was inspiring
so yeah we you know
we started break-in Aaron L was breaking
but he was popping uh and you know and
he used to do that back in the days and
since he was such a good dancer and so
coordinated he picked up like oh he was
an amazing popper like amazing but yeah
that that became our road and since our
main inspiration from the opposition was
a walks guy mmm bis became a walks yeah
we we did spins we did you know all the
spins but we care deeply about walks
yeah that's that's kind of crazy because
like definitely you guys like it it's
like walks and for people who don't know
walks it's like the float how do you
explain yeah well that that you're on
your hands you're walking on your hands
legs are off the ground and you're kind
of going in let's ignore loading yeah
it's like a pocket of air is underneath
your body and you're just walking around
on your hands and there's so many
variations of it but yeah yeah and you
guys innovated those moves which is
crazy that like I guess before you even
break you saw someone else like kind of
well I mean there were guys in the past
you know like we didn't really know him
too much except for when we started
break-in since there were no examples of
breaking like we saw it in person
mm-hmm and then when we wanted to start
learning we're you know just a few
break-in yeah you know beat Street like
those were our only examples of breakin
because there was no YouTube there was
no footage it was what you saw in person
other than those couple movies that were
on some VHS tapes you know and of course
there were guys you know in B Street and
break-in that that did you know some
high-level walks you know there's buck
for of course oh you know here is his
Turtles he's super fast you know amazing
but not not a lot of and then of course
in break-in
there's handyman you know amazing you
know his amazing walks but that those
are only a couple variations that were
shown on tape not the rest we were just
going and figuring it out yeah and you
know hearing from some of the oh geez
for master movements you know giving us
ideas on things that they had done or
seen or heard about you know so they
were kind of just giving us some input
try this oh there's a walk like this all
there's you know but they couldn't do it
they were already done but that lease
were given us the ideas and kind of a
framework of what you know just some
things to try and work on uh-huh and
from there we were just working at it
you know like determined to get good at
that no yeah you know and then of course
it ended up leading you know after
several years to higher level walks I me
and my brother were teaching the guys
from 101 up in Pasadena and you know
those were guys like brick Rand dab
stones which at the time his name was
there because you know they used to tag
so okay and did you ever do it I was
never in attacking oak I just straight
into Jane into dancing yeah I went
straight from like sports into dance
yeah you know but yeah you know so those
guys you know we we taught those guys
and then had the scene was just you know
getting a little yeah so what inspired I
guess your creativity within that dance
I mean I guess obviously going from
housing to to breaking and I mean I
imagine a lot of a lot of that had
influenced your style I mean because
housing
or at least the housing from back then
was very kind of kind of jumpy and right
well yes I believe LOI well very flowy
but you know and there was different
styles in in house you know it was not
same movements there were guys that had
a very rigid hard-hitting style there
was others they had flowing there there
was a lot of popping elements oh yeah in
it so so even in in the West Coast house
there there was a lot of different looks
yeah you know that that kind of
differentiated each you know dancers own
particular persona yeah you know and the
way they moved so you know when we
started moving into break-in we were it
was mainly power based mm-hm we did some
style but from what we had seen because
our experience was very little and there
was no footage there was not a lot of
differentiation in style so I kind of we
kind of did it just to say we had style
just to kind of check that box but it it
wasn't at least for myself I was not
highly inspired to do style because I
felt like it was in a box from what I
what I had seen the experience it wasn't
until the tapes of storm and them that
kind of made their way over here that
like the realization that oh you can do
so much with it it's it really is just
like house yeah like it really is you
know style is really as far as your mind
your creativity your persona yeah yeah
like yeah levels personality silly silly
things
yeah that end up looking dope you know
like there was just that that
realization that oh like there's no
limits there's no like yeah like it's
dance just at different levels and yeah
a different way but it's still dance
just just like house so from their style
it you know I was all about that you
know like it it became a very fun and a
never-ending puzzle that to this day I
work on yeah yeah it is a puzzle I mean
what drove me to breaking actually is
something similar is that it there was
no limit you can come come into it and
just kind of have fun with it do
whatever you want make it work you know
really like if you had a dumb idea to
see to try to make something work just
roll around on the ground see make try
to make it work you know some of the
most amazing steps that happen are by
accident definitely you know just from
the attempt of something new you you
provide yourself with an opportunity to
do something that you know maybe it
works and that's amazing
or it doesn't work out but it turns out
to be a better step yeah because it was
something that your body just
automatically had that on a DNA level
yeah that you were not aware of you know
with your own consciousness but on a
more subatomic level yeah your body
already had it yeah in tow and was just
ready for you just for you to give it
the opportunity yeah I'm completely
convinced that every move in braking was
from someone just falling down and going
oh let me try to control that and do the
same thing though but you know and just
make it look cool you know well well
yeah I mean it it you know it's a
constant thing to where you're trying to
like expand or go into neutral uncharted
territory yeah you know when we first
started like you know for me the thing
that keeps me coming back is I know I'll
never have this bad boy figure it out
you know but it's so fun just because
I'm I'm always searching for things like
some
No you know like like as if I was a
brand-new b-boy who it was first
stepping onto the floor for the first
time and I have that same thought
process and what I love is the guys you
know Rob and Cujo and all the other guys
you know that that run in our circle
have a similar mind frame yeah of play
mm-hmm you know like what we do is very
serious but we play like children you
know like it's it's something that
brings joy that's something that we you
know approached like the first time
we're not afraid to give each other
input or to to move in a weird position
you know just because yeah there's
something exhilarating about about that
just playing around and just planning
you know something pull one actually
told me is that the reason he likes the
word b-boy rather than something
different like be men or the adult or
whatever is that really you have your
own adult responsibilities but when you
come to break you are letting your inner
child to come out to play and that's why
the word b-boy or b-girl is more
appropriate than something like a B man
or B woman just because you're letting
your child come out and have fun and I I
think anybody who is I don't want to say
doing it properly because not to demean
anyone else but at least for myself to
me that's doing it right yeah it is
allowing yourself to be free
and I think when you you know
particularly associate with children
there's a freedom that they have that as
adults we lose many at least many lose
on various levels they they lose their
freedom they lose their they have these
preconceived notions that oh well I'm an
adult now yeah and so I need to respond
this way or I need to give this
I need to do you know and that's not the
case that you know you could absolutely
be a responsible person a caring
individual that handles all the various
responsibilities of your day-to-day but
still be that child to still carry your
inner child in various parts of your
life I mean I still I still watch anime
and cartoons oh yeah
to this day yeah yeah you know it's it's
a you know it's funny I had this thing
with my yeah I'd said the other day we
were watching something it had to do
with you know fairy tales type stuff in
and for a second she seemed
disinterested I said okay you know let's
turn this off I'll watch this later and
she's like oh no don't be like that
she's like it's just you know I'm not a
child I didn't want I said well why do
you you know like why why do you have to
lose your imagination just because we're
a certain age why why do you have to
give up your imagination why do you have
to give these things up like we handle
all the things we need to handle you
know like they're not hurting you that
there is there is nothing wrong with
having an imagination and creativity and
holding on to that that childlike party
yourself and and I think it helps us
connect and you know even with our own
children you know why like I think our
children are more connected to us and
love us all the more because we
understand them just you know on some
level just a little bit different than
maybe a Parenthood isn't holding on to a
part there yeah their inner child yeah
this is like a subject that's pretty
dear to me because you know my mother
she's an artist and she's you know she
was working with a lot of people that
were you know under they had a lot of
problems drug abuse all sorts of stuff
like that so she was running this
program where she would teach them art
kind of as a therapy and they were
finding that when these people really
hadn't
done anything creative in their life for
a long time and once they started doing
that creative these creative things it
started like sparking up a change in
their life for the better so that they
were more willing to get their life
together and so it was like something
that they were just lacking as a human
in their life and so it made me really
think that or believe that creativity is
just like this fundamental thing that
that humans need and I mean and I think
it's deeply connected with like play you
know this is our way we play well I mean
like of course people and is one thing
you know being able to play laughter
mm-hmm
you know of course the scientific
studies you know yeah yeah how laughter
and being able to tap into things that
bring us joy mm-hmm you know life is
hard before you know particularly for
adults a lot of responsibilities to be
able to take a moment for yourself to be
able to put all of that on pause and to
be able to let go of everything in tap
into something that is that fulfills you
that brings you fulfillment brings you a
joy you know and different people find
it in different ways you know and
certainly you know dance does that for
us
but yeah it's a it's an important thing
to be able to find things that bring you
meaning that bring you joy that that
allow you to play and create you know in
one form or fashion mm you know when
people talk about me and dance and you
know like I guess I still look fairly
young you know I'm 45 now but you know
most that speak with me think I'm much
younger and it's just because I think
it's because I allow myself I make some
for myself you know there there's a
different side different purpose whether
it be taking care of myself you know
dance has done a lot for me you know the
way I take care of myself the way I eat
sleep the way I you know take time for
exercise stretching and and that's all
for my dance yeah you know so for me
dance has been you know a true blessing
just because I would have to find the
motivations you know to somehow pull and
do those things on my own but you know I
would have to generate it somewhere else
because for me my motivation for doing
all of those things has to do with my
performance as a dancer and you know
it's funny I was talking about storm as
you know motivation one of the things I
liked is I'd seen him on many occasions
but never spoke with them because he was
always surrounded by so many people so
many other dancers they had admiration
for him yeah because of course it's
deserved but I never wanted to meet him
in that way because even though I have
all the admiration in the world for how
he influenced me I don't think any one
is better than me I don't think I'm
better than anyone else but I don't
think anyone else is better than me
mm-hmm
you know we're humans yeah you know that
inspire each other but I didn't want him
to see me that way
to where everyone's like tugging at his
coattails yeah so so even though I had
opportunities I never spoke with him and
then one of the times at one of the free
saw sessions I had seen him with the
guys from soul control with which are
like my little brothers Charles and Cujo
and they were sitting and just talking
with them and I was like amazing yeah
because those are my guys and I could
just sit down and talk uh-huh you know
and I got they introduced me to him and
I had the opportunity to
be able to let him know that I really
appreciated what he had done for me
helping me I inspired me and helped me
to understand yeah that that it really
was like dance you know and made style
fun about a week later he was up north
for an event up that way and Charles was
going up there to hang out with them and
and kind of take care of him show him
around drives him and had invited me to
come I went up there and so from there I
got to be around him more and just talk
you know and with and humanized walked
well yeah yeah not not just about dance
just about whatever oh yeah and you know
like I think one of the things he
appreciates is when people just treat
him like a normal person
yeah yeah like you know he understands
that that he's had impact but he he
knows he's a normal guy too you know and
wants to have stimulating conversation
with people who who treat him just like
any other person and we had that you
know and to this day we do I was talking
with him the other day and we're
chopping up over some other stuff you
know but we were able to build on that
and then when we finally danced together
like we we hadn't you know we just hung
out and talked hmm philosophies on
whether it be life b-boying to dance the
way we saw it and we saw things very
much the same and then it wasn't until
the very end of the weekend that we were
over at mega man's house and it was I
think his lady's birthday and we were in
all in the living room big wood floor
you know okay and we started off locking
and we were having fun that way and then
I said oh now I feel like breaking
and we we started breaking he went out
the guys were going out he went out and
then there was a time I was gonna go I
was gonna go out and I went out and I
think he like he just wasn't he didn't
think that I could I guess dance on the
level I was dancing huh
so I got up and he was about to go out
and he kind of had like a uh like and
then he pushed somebody else out and
they went out instead and then it's like
and then he ran something through his
mind and then of course right after that
person finished she went out and
destroyed it yeah but me and him must
have went like 20-something around oh
wow
yeah like we were just having fun
Yelp plane and and I didn't know it at
the time you know cuz I was just having
fun exchanging and it ended up becoming
a thing where a lot of the guys were
watching and meet me and storm were
exchanging to you know just playing
and I remember Gerald rest in peace you
know one of our other Gerald caster low
he had come in and said yo Charles wants
to go like like you know we're waiting
on you guys and I was like oh storm we
got to go and storm had told general
like yo tell Charles we'll be out in a
little while and then he looked at me
said yo ace let's keep going
and then we just kept going for or a
while longer and when we left you know
he was like really happy you know I mean
I knew I was happy but he was having
he's like yo ace like I haven't danced
like that in like I can't even tell you
how long you know and I was like get out
of here bro like you know like you're in
a different country like every week you
know surrounded by amazing dancers
uh-huh
no no no you know it's different you
know like people either are in like
looking like look at me like too high or
they're trying too hard to impress me
you know like instead like just six he
said me and you we were just kind of
having a conversation you know and and
that's the whole thing about dance dance
is a conversation you know like like
he's like you were doing something
that's giving me ideas and I was going
out and doing something then you were
getting ideas and he like he said you
know that that I haven't had that in a
really long time yeah you know where
somebody just had a conversation with me
you know and he said like for me that
that just blew my mind and like I said
you know we well we're kind of I don't
know to me kind of like kindred spirits
like you know like we see things a lot a
lot the same way and you know I feel
blessed that I have people like Robyn
puja you know like we're all kind of in
that you know like I try to surround
myself with people that are like-minded
you know that you have that
open-mindedness and and if they don't I
try to cultivate it yeah yeah you know
and help them to understand that because
at least for myself that's where I found
the real joy in dance is in the exchange
in the conversation in being open-minded
to new ways of moving and taking
something and flipping it yeah you know
on its side on its back on its head
whatever it might be you know cuz
there's no one way of looking at this
thing like you know and the beautiful
part is we will never have this thing
figured out and it's what keeps me
coming back yeah because when I come out
to a dance floor when I go to a practice
there's an exhilaration that I have no
idea what's gonna happen today yeah yeah
and that's amazing uh-huh you know I
like I gave up the preconceived notion
oh this is what I'm gonna do this I have
a few ideas like oh I want to try this
today on that I just give it up because
I found that when I go out with
preconceived notions that oh I'm gonna
do this this this and this you think too
much
that's what it becomes well I mean in
the end like we talked about that
subatomic level how you go in and you're
gonna do this move and it doesn't work
out and sometimes it works out better
yeah because your body on a subatomic
level new nope we're doing this yeah
when you try to work against your body
when you work you know like your body's
gonna win and you could just come out
all kinds of ugly you like you know like
at some level you have to give in to
wherever your body's at on that day like
oh I'm will work on this if it if your
body says nope we're doing this instead
you got you like you're best off
trusting because in the end your your
DNA knows better yeah for me like what
I've always done is and what I've been
trying to do a lot more is like when I
train I'll train you know different
sequences of movements that I think work
well together but when I actually dance
you know perform or battle or whatever I
try to just not think of anything I just
try to focus on music try to focus on
whoever I'm battling or whatever I'm
performing at just focus on the moment
and just let my body do whatever it's
gonna do because I've spent all the time
in practice working through different
combinations that I think makes sense
that I trust that my body's gonna know
when to do that or when not to do that
so if I just focus more on music and
just let let it happen it just feels
more natural to me it probably looks
more natural to and then hopefully those
combinations I have been practicing make
their way out in some form and you know
I'm happy with that too so it sounds
like that's maybe like what you do as
well yeah I mean I have ideas you know
like I think it's it's it's at least for
myself good to go out like okay I want
these things to come out at some point
in time you know yeah like and
a lot of the muscle memory will kick in
yeah it is moving yeah you know if
you've put together certain combinations
and certain movements you know they're
gonna come together at some point
they're gonna execute just because
you've done these different things but
of course there's a spontaneity to our
dance and you know working in with music
and all that you know and of course I
feel that music is important I feel like
I think there's some people that that
play too hard to the music to where they
start to kind of lose themselves that
and when you hit him you know and and to
each their own
yeah every single beat you know
sometimes when people work every single
beat then they they kind of lose I guess
a certain moment like for me like I'm in
the flow of the music the way I dance I
stay in the flow in the pocket of the
music and then I accent different parts
that I want really to stick out or stand
out and being in that wave the rest just
going and flowing through the rest of
the music you know and there are some
people who are amazing hidden every
every single beat for me I I see a lot
of hit or miss with that though too
sometimes it's a super amazing moment
that's etched in the history of time
that's enough well there's others that
it was like I kind of lost the message
oh yeah like they're trying too hard to
do every single thing and it's like okay
I don't they stay in the story you're
actually trying to portray now yeah
because I mean at least for me I feel
like when we're you know when I go out
and the dancers that I seem to gravitate
a little bit to a a little bit more
they're they're moving and they're
telling some sort of story you know
to make you know beginning a middle and
an end you know and just for me the ones
that every single be every single time
like I said there there are some
spectacular moments you know some rounds
that will always be remembered but then
there's also some times that you are
left walking away soon I didn't really
get what they were trying to tell me you
know just me you know that just the way
you know I see it so so it's definitely
a catch-22 and it's a difficult thing to
pull off and only a certain few are
really at least to me that that I've
seen that really pull that off and make
me say oh wow okay they're like that
that they pull it off more times than
not yet they have a higher ratio you
know higher percentage of being able to
pull it off what what is one of the I
guess highlight moments that you've seen
I guess in all your history of the dance
what's something that stands out I mean
obviously your story with battling storm
is probably a highlight but what about
other things maybe something that you
may be a battling with we were we were
sharing you know yeah it was a
conversation yeah of course that was a
hot like you know like I've just had you
know with the moments there's there's
just so many you know I mean just no
just sharin in the community seeing all
the different generations of dancers you
know come through and give their give
their party inspire in their way and
then being able on our end to be able to
partake in and share with them like as
you know whatever practice that I'm at
or event if I see something that I feel
can be helpful to another dancer you
know I'll usually make my way over and
just kind of throw it out there
say you know like this is take it or
leave it you know you don't you
certainly don't need to use this but
this is this is something that I see
that I think can help your dance but you
know like like I hope you don't take
that you know the wrong way yeah
because we've always been a firm
believer you know me and the guys have
always been firm believers in in helping
bring bring the next dancers or even
veterans like it doesn't matter like
I've had guys that have come to me
you know so many like you know and say
hey you know I know people look at us
like legends you know but like we we
want to grow to like you know what like
doesn't mean that that we don't want to
learn yeah you know and I knew what that
kind of meant like that they were
looking for help and for me like I'll
help anybody who has a decent heart you
know so I my response has always been
like well yeah of course like if we're
not learning and growing what are we
doing here you know like anyone who
thinks they have this dance figured out
yeah they're out of their mind
yeah and they've stopped growing yeah
you know that that that's two things cuz
the moment you think you have anything
figured out growth is done like there is
no more growth the moment you think you
have it figured out you're wrong you
don't have it figured yeah because it's
an endless thing but if for those who
are you know lucid or out of their mind
enough to think that they do have
figured out and oh I'm on this level so
the growth is done like it you stop so
so anyone who who has ever like a like I
said I offer it up you know to to anyone
just really I'll walk over you know and
offer it up so if somebody were to ask
me you know in many who are considered
legends of course
many you know they've been my students
you know and others that have made their
legend status on their own but just are
still on the path of growth if they've
ever had a question or wanted to learn
something I'm all for it you know
because yeah like we don't
let's keep growing let's keep doing it
you know feel free to ask me anytime
like I love it you know it's
ever-changing thing I mean hip-hop I
guess if you look at it throughout its
history every couple years it's a
different thing and so if you're not I
guess you know evolving with it you're
also you know you're losing yourself a
little bit you know kinda you know as
far as ever evolving it on some level
it's fads - oh yeah you know on some
level things come and go so you know
it's cool to pay attention and to keep
growing but if it's something that that
calls to you - cuz in the end you still
have to be true to who you are as an
artist yeah so there's a lot of things
that I see that like look great but I
don't feel they're for me
so I continue to grow in the ways that
move me you know because if we're
constantly worrying about what somebody
else is doing and what's in right now
then we're never really gonna find
ourselves you know like we're never
gonna find who we are as a dancer and to
continue to build us like to build
yourself as an artist so but if so you
know it's good to pay attention because
if you see something that says wow like
yes I want to use that and incorporate
that into my dance because I think that
that will take what I want to do and you
know change you know take my art where I
want it to go
you know like we talked about at one of
the last practices a vision a vision for
your dance you know you may not be able
to do everything that you want to do but
I think any any great artists has had
some sort of vision for what they want
to do like some grand scheme like Oh
like that's kind of crazy you know and
you may not be able to do it now but if
you have when you have that vision you
know you kind of start doing different
movements and different exercises and
stretches and whatever else whatever
else it might be to kind of work towards
that goal you know to work towards that
vision you know and then of course
there's a whole lot of play that comes
along that that will change your vision
around but but I feel like you know all
the great artists have to have some some
sort of vision you know even if it
changes along the way you know to have a
vision and to work towards a vision you
know and not be to be cognizant of
what's around you but not consumed to
where you have to do what they do to
know like okay you know that's dope and
I recognize that's dope but that's not
you know I'm gonna continue to do what I
do and take the parts that I really want
that I feel will take me towards my
vision yeah yeah the thing that me and
Vince do a lot is we'll see what other
people are doing you know what the fad
really is and rather than try to do that
we'll go okay if someone does that
against me in a battle like what am I
gonna do well ya know I mean I know you
can respond to it well especially if
you're looking for battles you know the
responses to to questions you know or
yeah to be able to respond and kind of
you know in a battle you know
this is what is generally out there yeah
this is gonna come and you have a
response you know those are just good
battle tactics to be able to have a
response within what you did well yeah
what I do yeah you know but but you
already have answers to the question
exactly you know so yeah those are those
are things that are very important and
then of course like you said you know
and then things like battles and stuff
like that that's a that's a whole
different you know it's its own element
and conversation and being able to I
mean of course you have to do what you
do but be able to like even the way we
package what we do you know our
movements and and the packaging and
delivery of what we do can be the energy
in which we do what we do it's very
different yeah you know like yeah you
know it but I think one of the important
things is that it comes from a genuine
place you see a lot of actors you know
in the scene to where yeah it's that's
not really who they are it's not a
genuine part of their dance actor I've
never heard someone say that but that's
what it is yeah it's acting you know and
the ones who like are best at what they
do I think more times than not things do
come from a genuine place yeah that's
why it receives more credit like then
not because people can fill something
genuine behind their movements and at
least for the ones to me that that stand
out and over time like they still like
not just when in a jam and not just when
in an event but being admired being able
to be understood as a pioneer of what
they do and to be like to draw
inspiration from other
to where because they just see something
that is more genuine in in in their
movements than the typical person who
executes things and wins that Jam
there's a lot of people who win gems
that are not maybe and never really be
remembered you know I'm sure there's so
many people you know when you look back
you're like who won this gem who on that
Jam and not remember them whereas
there's people like Rob Silla or a Cujo
yeah that have lost more gems than the
other one and you remember there but but
they will when when their name is talked
about people know and are like wow like
that guy is amazing I'm glad you brought
that up because I have the same thought
about it is because there's so many
battles I remember vividly because you
know either I was there I saw footage
and I was like this is a crazy amazing
battle and I can't remember who won you
know that battle or who won the jam or
anything about it other than the battle
and who was in it I could tell you
exactly what each person is wearing or
whatever in the battle but I'm like I
have no idea if they even won the gym I
don't even know where the jam was you
know what I mean yeah and I could care
less to be honest but that battle there
was crazy and it's cemented in my brain
as like one of the coolest things I've
ever seen you know and so it just goes
to show you that the jam is not the
defining thing it's and the win and
winning a jam is not the defining thing
it's it's like the moments that you're
creating the moments that you create the
way you inspire and an hour inspire by
others and the way you inspire others
with dancing from a genuine place you
know just yeah though though many
dancers have come to me over the years
and said oh what do you think I should
work on and what would you recommend for
this you know Ana's like okay you know
we'll one
what is your end goal are you looking to
win a jam or are you looking to be
remembered mmm
you know because those are two
completely different things yeah yeah
you know and then I usually bring up the
analogy of things like Cujo and Rob and
stuff like that you know and that that
when people bring up their name they're
always like people now automatically
know who they are yeah you know and
they're inspired and think like wow like
yeah he dances like nobody's business
like I don't even know how he came up
with that you know whereas there's many
others that that are amazing
they you know they are they execute you
know mm-hmm well maybe they just haven't
found their Oh something that makes that
stands out but solely yeah it's where
this belongs to this person like no
nobody dances like this guy you know
when somebody tells me like Oh ace you
know like I don't know I don't think I
dance like okay I suppose maybe because
I don't think too much about my own
dance I just enjoy the process always in
process and you know and I just there's
a just a genuine joy in dance but when
somebody comes to me and says oh man
like yeah like when you dance like I
know it's you like nobody dances like
you I mean like you bring that brings me
a joy and satisfaction because that's my
end goal I don't know if I'm if I'm
doing it you know and on to what level
you know but for me I want the freedom
of being me I want you know when I dance
I'm trying to just find me all the time
yeah you know and and it's a continual
thing because we're ever-changing we're
ever-growing you know like the me of
ninety-one should not be the me of now
mm-hmm
you know I should be a different me so
even even when I go out and dance today
I'm searching for my truth today who am
i today you know and just being open to
if that's
different you know I think for the most
part it's going to there's gonna be a
feel of who you are but but new aspects
of yourself yeah you know and I don't
know for me that that's what I
I thought about creativity as an artist
it's not to just hold on to you know to
find yourself but doesn't mean you have
to be the you of three years ago or last
week or you know like that person was
amazing at that time love it cherish it
and move on move on because you can't
ever recreate those moments those
moments were wonderful at that time but
if you're stuck there you know it's
never gonna be the same you know you can
do the same combination it's never gonna
be exactly the way it was at that moment
in time on that day and you know and
yeah I had to learn that a long time ago
too you know I had this some different
amazing moments you know that that just
came about and I tried to recreate them
and worse worse sessions ever just
because that moment had passed you know
and the moment I came to the realization
that you gotta let go you know and
understand that that was a beautiful
moment at that time but that is over
yeah and and trust like we talked about
on a DNA level that whatever your body
is telling you and wherever you're at at
that point in time
trust it go with it as long as you feel
you're not
imitating or copying somebody else you
you're kind of finding your way and
finding your truth for that day that's
where the beauty lies kind of embracing
the view of right now and moving with it
of course because I know buddy's just
gonna change and being a completely
different person but you can find
definitely new elements of yourself you
know if you're open to it and for me
that that's what makes you know
being an artist so much fun it is
finding these new parts of yourself like
every single day yeah yeah so if you
were to go back in time to the 91
version of you and tell that version of
you I guess some advice what would you
do what would that be oh god you know I
I'm not really sure about what I would
tell myself back then because I've
enjoyed the process the whole way you
announced observe you know like you mean
observe myself of old or observe you now
going back in time to see the 91 version
of you would you say anything or no or
you just observe or just well you know
it that's a double-edged sword too
because yeah it might change well you
know like for me I've enjoyed the
journey yeah the journey is fun it's all
about you know like it's all about the
journey like you know the beauty of
today like I've had so many amazing
moments throughout my life but I think
it's because I understand that I'm only
given today I don't like iived at this
point just because I woke up every
single morning and said well I still
love it so I'm gonna do it like that's
it
I've never in my wildest dreams would
have imagined that going on near 30
years that I'm still you know 45 years
old still busting still still breaking
you know stay still dance in period at
45 you know when I was a teenager you
know 16 year old you know a 16 year old
kid started we thought somebody who you
know busted for nine years was like whoa
at that he's so gee like that's cool
like nine years yeah like in here yeah
more than tripled that yeah you know and
[Music]
yeah like that's it's just crazy to even
think that that we would still be denser
and and
level like you know that that's you know
one of the things that me and storm were
talking about the other day
was the the joy of dancing still at high
level having high expectations for
ourselves and saying I never ever want
old man props like I'm sorry I dance
because when I dance you know like I do
the things I do I take pride in my dance
like I love the process but make no
mistake about it when I'm on a dance
floor with other dancers I want them to
understand that I'm a bad man yeah that
that when I do things that I do things
that that they can't do even younger
yeah like you know doing walks clothes
like you know certain Power Move
combinations that I can do it 45 that it
that some of the younger cats can do
cats don't do walks like me and Cujo
yeah yeah yeah they just don't it's it's
not the same the the west coast
merry-go-rounds Deadman's all the
different high level sky turtles
carousels whatever you want to call them
like all the different variations we
walk around that we glide around a room
with our body fully extended we're not
hopping in one place you know and I know
a lot of people they don't know they
don't understand you know and on some
level yeah it's weird and arrogant but
the walks that are out there are on an
elementary level in comparison to the
way that me and Cujo dueled is like oh
it's a lost art I think I mean a lot of
it absolutely it absolutely is and
people will never understand it until
until they try it when they when they
start down the journey of doing it the
way me and Cujo do it they understand
there they have a what that hell moment
life you know
one of the homies gastro from
Guadalajara he was down here in Los
Angeles dude is so strong super super
strong has amazing walks the way
everyone else does him mmm
hoppy well you know no problem knock it
out the box I started taking him under
my wing
you know Cujo was trying to show himself
and then he started showing up and
wanting to practice with me in Seoul I
took him under my wing and started to
teach him the way me and Cujo did do and
like I said can do it the way everyone
else does it like nobody's business and
his can hold his body straight out like
nobody's business very strong but
learning how to do it the right way the
way we do it West Coast walks he
struggled struggled struggled struggled
and he was like I'm so tired bro
thank god this is so hard bro like you
know like month you know good month
working with him regularly struggling
yeah and finally he started to get it at
the end but this was like like a regular
thing that I was working with him
imparting my knowledge telling him don't
put your hand here and get your hips
over here faster do this you know along
with all of his already previous
knowledge and he struggled with it and
he's starting to finally get it at the
end but then he had to go back to
Guadalajara and I told him practice
practice practice
because high level walks is not like
regular moves yeah like if I were to
associate it regular like most moves
that you get it it's like once you get
it you get it it's kind of like a
one-night stand with high-level walks
that's a marriage you're in a long-term
commitment you better keep at it because
she will get up and walk and leave
she will leave you and I told him this
about six months you know to a year like
between there went to vacation you know
when on vacation in Mexico was down
there and got a lotta met up with him
and his crew and he told me I'm so sorry
bro
I lost him like I didn't I didn't listen
to you I didn't practice them and
they're gone and so I told him okay you
know I'm gonna teach you again like you
know and we'll work at it this time
stick with it I have to see his account
to see where he's at but it just shows
it just it's an example of how just how
difficult high-level walks are the way
Cujo and I do them really are and I take
a lot of pride in that and I can still
mean Cujo both can do all of our walks
you know different combinations that
we've done from the past we can still do
them at a high level in our 40s yeah and
for me I take a lot of you know like the
moment I I can't dance the way I want to
dance
then maybe maybe I'm gonna stop I don't
know like I haven't gotten at that point
yet yeah you know but but I don't want
old man props you know I don't want
somebody to say oh man you should have
seen ace back in the days like oh like
you can't you can't tell can't see you
can't see it now you know but he used to
be really good yeah you know the thing
that brings me most joy is when a dancer
who doesn't even know me comes over to
me and says hey yeah like hey what's
your name like where are you from like
dude you're really good and then when I
tell them who I am and a little bit of
my history for them to have that you
know more like like I love that you know
because those props from a really good
dancer you mean more oh I mean you know
more times than not it's a really good
dancer you know somebody I say all that
guy's pretty good you know and then they
make their way over and reciprocate that
same love and admiration saying hey who
are you like you know when you walk over
to somebody that you just don't even
know and say I kind of have to know who
you are like I think highly enough of
your dance that I want to know who you
are and then you know then to find the
history later you know like and then of
course the admiration is much deeper
once they find out like well you're this
person you're a kudos teacher you're
this person's teacher you're four how
old are you yeah all 45 what you know
like like for me that is yeah there's a
satisfaction and enjoy because just as
an artist I want whoever it is it gives
me respect or respects what I do I want
it to be from a genuine place like if
it's not there I don't want it because
then that will feed by motivation to
work harder to get back to where I need
to be yeah like you know and there's you
know like I understand there's good play
people come from good places when
they're being nice but there's also
something that handicaps the other
person whether it be kids or girls or
whatever it might be
mm-hmm the reason why we've got into the
people who have gotten good it's because
there's there's a need of wanting to be
appreciated to be recognized to be
validated by others that they admire you
know there's a hunger you know not to
say people don't fulfill their own cup
by like you know being an artist but
they're I firmly believe that you know
and I think that that we all want to be
recognized by others we admire you know
we want to be validated and for that
person say that dude is good you know
like III really you know like what that
for the person I admire admires what I
do yeah Wow like okay that's you know
and that feeds our hunger that feeds our
flame you know so whatever it is I
always want it to come from a genuine
place you know and like I say means
storm we're laughing about that like
dude like I call it quits you know like
if I can't do what I do and and feel
good about my dance when I step on a
dance floor like I don't want anyone
giving me pity props I don't want
somebody saying oh that was you know
pretty good good job don't do it walk
away
yeah like oh you still got it yeah like
it's not that you still got it it's like
it never left it was always here and it
got better so that's that's what you're
going for
always I'm looking to grow I'm looking
to be a factor I'm looking to inspire
you know myself and others you know like
and I think a lot of really great
artists have this about themselves to
that they are their own biggest critic
yeah you know like yeah I know I like we
talked about having a vision you know
like I know what I want to do and I you
know it's something that that's been a
double-edged sword because I've always
been hard on myself to I could do
something incredible and it didn't work
out the way I wanted to and I kind of
walked away like walked out of the
circle like it wasn't amazing you know
we're where others are like you know
even pump you spoke about popo used to
tell me to he had to kind of help me
with that too yeah where he's like dude
what are you doing like you did
something amazing and you walked away
with your head down like he's like don't
that like you know play you know whether
what it would like nobody else knew that
you messed up like in your own head you
might have messed up yeah but nobody
else knew that I was like I'll tell you
that right now nobody else knew that the
only way they knew it is you walked away
with you
so that was you know that was something
that I'm good you break very precisely
to and so like I can imagine where you
meant to put your foot exactly in this
spot but you missed it by an inch and
you're like oh I messed up but literally
no one can tell that you didn't put it
an inch backwards where it was supposed
to be and you missed it so you'd get up
and go like oh crap I messed that up and
then they're like I don't know that was
crazy disappointed and that's you know
that that's kind of been my you know my
blessing and my curse because because
I'm always out there searching for my
own perfection it it pushes me I strive
you know I've worked I've always been a
worker like I said I had two left feet
you know people will see me they're like
what what do you mean you know but that
was terrible mm-hmm I was terrible I
worked for everything that I had I've
I've had to break down use trained use
my mind you know more than the average
dancer because I had to like I've always
had to break down yeah an understanding
of a step a combination of power move
body positioning like where I should be
at a certain point in time so when I'm
able to t like one I could a teacher
it's helped me to really be a good
teacher to others because I myself could
not do without having a full grasp or
understanding you understand the
intricacies of making them move yeah and
I you know I think you can make moves
work but I think for me where it's been
a blessing too is you know I've been
able to continue to grow and find more
efficient ways of doing things because I
just because I can do something doesn't
mean I feel like that's the only way and
that there's not a better way I'm always
searching to see if there's a better way
I'm always questioning myself like yeah
I feel it this way but I'm open to the
possibilities that I can do it better or
that there is a better way you know
because where I where I did something at
that point in time yeah it was effective
you know but yeah there's more you know
and we found a bunch of new ways whether
it be power moves or style of saying you
know what if you put your foot down
faster here you put this knee down you
know like and then we tried we're like
yeah that does work like dope and then
just a whole new range of possibilities
come in constantly you know so yeah it's
amazing man I love it well I think with
that being said we could probably in
this show we've been going for an hour
and 15 minutes already kind of time
flies by right yeah well yeah man I
appreciate you having me on you know
like just being able to speak about all
the possibilities and the culture and
our artistry mm-hmm you know cuz cuz
that's what we are you know I I always
appreciate the opportunities for to just
conversate ya know it's important to
kind of spread the ideas that we all
have and just put it out into the world
and see what other people have to say
about it and just you know I guess the
Zulu nation each one teach one is it's
important it's important in hip-hop to
do that well yeah it's it's going to you
know like we're only a moment in time we
are just a piece of of all of this so if
we keep it to ourselves where does all
that knowledge go after after we're done
after we leave you know like like I said
we're only promised today so even with
somebody who has good intentions oh
maybe later I'll get around to it you
know like they're not promised that time
so you know yeah being able to share
with each other is a vital part of any
society yeah and as we said this dance
hip hop is still in its infancy in a way
and that it you know there's so much
history that's you know beyond us so
it's good to get these ideas out now and
just because you know we don't know
where the scenes gonna go from here and
I mean it's it's it's exciting to see
what is in store for the future and
definitely yeah so well thank you for
coming on do you have any last-minute
shoutouts or anything you want to say or
any plugs or anything which oh well just
you know the guys you know my brothers
whether it be master movements soul
control you know my my various
inspirations around the world you know
my teacher airnow Coloma you know like
forgiving me just an opportunity you
know and even when he sees me now you
know he says and you were like the last
person I ever would have thought would
have made hey you know yeah an impact
but look II look at you after all these
years you know but but nobody can
measure your heart your desire your play
your you know and many of the great
dancers I see around the world started
with similar themes to where it was hard
for them at the beginning but nobody can
measure their heart so you know if you
have a want for something do it for you
you know in the end always do it for you
and have fun doing it the whole way
through don't let anyone tell you what
you can or
do I had that from the very beginning
and many others have also we can do
whatever we put our mind to and I won't
have fun along the way here to here
alright thanks you guys for listening
[Music]
[Music]
you
More Episodes
All Episodes>>You may also like
Get this podcast on your phone, Free
Create Your Podcast In Minutes
- Full-featured podcast site
- Unlimited storage and bandwidth
- Comprehensive podcast stats
- Distribute to Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and more
- Make money with your podcast
