Talkin‘ Politics & Religion Without Killin‘ Each Other

ICYMI: Alexander Vindman — The Folly of Realism

2025-12-05

One of the clearest, most necessary voices on Ukraine, democracy, and what the West keeps getting wrong. In this ICYMI episode, Corey revisits his most recent conversation with Dr. Alexander Vindman — retired U.S. Army Lieutenant Colonel, former Director for European Affairs on the National Security Council, and author of The Folly of Realism: How the West Deceived Itself About Russia and Betrayed Ukraine. From the thousand-year struggle for Ukrainian sovereignty to why U.S. administrations repeatedly misread Russia, Vindman explains how we arrived at this moment —...

One of the clearest, most necessary voices on Ukraine, democracy, and what the West keeps getting wrong.

In this ICYMI episode, Corey revisits his most recent conversation with Dr. Alexander Vindman — retired U.S. Army Lieutenant Colonel, former Director for European Affairs on the National Security Council, and author of The Folly of Realism: How the West Deceived Itself About Russia and Betrayed Ukraine.

From the thousand-year struggle for Ukrainian sovereignty to why U.S. administrations repeatedly misread Russia, Vindman explains how we arrived at this moment — and what a values-based foreign policy (“neo-idealism”) could mean for America’s future. He also opens up about family history, his brother Eugene’s first term in Congress, and what gives him both concern and hope in a destabilized world.

🧭 If you're new to TP&R through Podbean, Overcast, or a friend’s recommendation, this episode is a timely, clear-eyed introduction: personal, historically grounded, urgently relevant, and we even have some fun!

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⏱️ Timestamps & Key Topics

[00:00] Why Alexander Vindman’s voice has become essential to TP&R
[00:03] Eugene Vindman’s first term in Congress — governing from a purple district
[00:11] Lessons from military families, public service, and bipartisan problem-solving
[00:17] Reconnecting with family in Ukraine — personal history meets geopolitics
[00:24] The thousand-year struggle for Ukrainian sovereignty
[00:34] Russia’s imperial narrative and why the West kept buying it
[00:41] Nuclear weapons, U.S. policy missteps, and the legacy of denuclearization
[00:51] Neo-Idealism: Why values must guide U.S. foreign policy
[00:56] What worries Vindman about Trump 2.0 — and where he still finds hope
[01:08] The TP&R Question: How to talk across deep differences

🧠 Key Takeaways

History matters. Ukraine’s fight for independence is centuries old — and central to understanding today’s war.
The West misread Russia. U.S. administrations succumbed to “hopes and fears,” offering accommodation instead of strategy.
Nuclear exceptionalism distorts policy. Fear of escalation often hands leverage to bad actors.
Values are interests. Neo-Idealism argues that long-term U.S. strategy must be rooted in democratic principles.
Domestic health = foreign strength. The fight for democracy abroad is inseparable from the one at home.