Dive into the future of enterprise data with the latest episode of Tech-Driven Business. Mustansir Saifuddin welcomes Shawn Brown, of SAP, for Part 1 of an in-depth exploration of the SAP Business Data Cloud (BDC). If you're navigating the complexities of data management and analytics within the SAP ecosystem, this episode is unmissable. Shawn breaks down the fundamental 'why' behind BDC, revealing how it's engineered to drastically reduce data preparation time, cut costs, and empower businesses to make faster, more accurate...
Dive into the future of enterprise data with the latest episode of Tech-Driven Business. Mustansir Saifuddin welcomes Shawn Brown, of SAP, for Part 1 of an in-depth exploration of the SAP Business Data Cloud (BDC). If you're navigating the complexities of data management and analytics within the SAP ecosystem, this episode is unmissable. Shawn breaks down the fundamental 'why' behind BDC, revealing how it's engineered to drastically reduce data preparation time, cut costs, and empower businesses to make faster, more accurate decisions. Tune in to understand how you can your team can take advantage of all that BDC offers to SAP customers looking to unlock true value from their data.
With over two decades of experience in SAP solutions, Shawn Brown currently serves as Senior Director for SAP’s Center of Excellence. Known for expertly identifying customer needs, Mr. Brown excels in presenting tailored solutions involving Business Technology Platform, Business Data Cloud, S4HANA, and Business AI. A proven leader in demand generation and partner relationship management, Mr. Brown has successfully driven initiatives that enhance customer experience and streamline cloud solution adoption. Renowned as a thought leader and strategist, Mr. Brown frequently shares insights with CIOs and business influencers, fostering strong, trust-based relationships across multiple industries.
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Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Mustansir Saifuddin: Welcome to Tech- Driven Business, brought to you by Innovative Solution Partners. I'm honored to have Sean Brown of SAP join me to kick off an essential two part series to unpack a topic that's on every SAP user's mind. The Business Data Cloud or BDC. If you're looking to understand how BDC can transform your data landscape and drive real business value, you are in the right place.
[00:00:32] .
[00:00:32] Welcome to Tech- Driven Business, Shawn. How are you?
[00:00:35] Shawn Brown: I am good. I'm good. Things are going well, staying busy.
[00:00:38] Mustansir Saifuddin: That's awesome. That's awesome. So glad to have you on our show and I'm really excited for the topic that we are going to discuss today. You ready for it?
[00:00:47] Shawn Brown: I am. I'm excited as well.
[00:00:51] Mustansir Saifuddin: Yeah, so I, I know we had talked in the past a couple of times and right now , the hot topic everybody's talking about from SAP and in general is the whole idea, the concept, and now the actual product called Business Data Cloud and what it really means for SAP customers. I like to use this time to dig deeper into this conversation and have a better understanding of exactly what this brings, what kind of landscapes that are changing with this new product, and to expect, you know, if you're a customer interested into, in going forward with BDC.
[00:01:28] Shawn Brown: -.
[00:01:28] Sure. That sounds great. Yeah.
[00:01:32] Mustansir Saifuddin: Awesome. Okay. So I think every time we, we have this new products, right? And SAP is really good about and talk, people talk about rebranding and all that. Let's talk about the why of why should SAP customers adopt BDC. What is different about BDC that SAP customers should be asking that question.
[00:01:53] Why?
[00:01:55] Shawn Brown: Yeah, this is, this is my favorite question to start. Anything in the space that is outside of packaged solutions, you know ERP, HR Supply Chain and, and the capabilities we have in those areas because the why is something that it, it should be the driver for everything. Right? And, and for BDC, I would say the first thing we wanna talk about is it's a, it's a new product.
[00:02:24] But it's an evolution of everything that we've been doing for years. It's, it's capabilities that our customers already know about. And it's taking all of the capabilities that we have offered over the time that we've been, been in the data and analytics space. And it's the, I call it a next generation, right?
[00:02:45] It's the next generation of what was. And so when we get into the why. I would say the first thing that we really gotta say is, is the reason for BDC is it is to short circuit the amount of time it takes to prepare from data to finally analytics and planning and all the steps in between, where we're often times organizations see it as this, this wheel that.
[00:03:15] They start with the data that's in the source system. They're gonna extract a, transform it loaded profile it, catalog it you know, press governance on it. Maybe make it in, you know, in a marketplace setting. Organize it so that it can be easily digestible, create some standard analytics, and then now we can actually start analyzing it.
[00:03:34] And the why is really about reducing the amount of time it takes to go around that whole wheel of, Data all the way around to analytics and planning and reduce the amount of prep time and increase the amount of analysis time. Because if we think about how much time a person gets to analyze the [00:04:00] data, let's say for example, and this is a, this is actually a number that is, has been verified with numerous customers and with, the analyst firms like Gartner and Forrester and TDWI is that it takes as much as 70% or more of the actual workload and investment to go from data to analytics. That's not, so that means the analytics is just 30% or less of the time. So if we think about how much each question costs. You have to add in all of that cost that even deliver up the analytical or, or deliver up the, the data in a way that it can be analyzed.
[00:04:45] So BDCs goal is to shrink that time of preparation and actual delivery of data for the analyst purpose or for the AI purpose, or for any application purpose. Shrink it as much as possible so that, the questions that are asked are cheaper, and essentially we can ask more questions. We don't have to continue to reformat the data, deliver the data in a new way to get to the final answers that we're trying to seek.
[00:05:20] So I would say savings and costs. Savings and money. More data, more, more analysis time. That's the why for BDC.
[00:05:31] Mustansir Saifuddin: Yeah, it totally makes sense. I think one of the things that while you're talking about this that stuck out for me was, we always talk about time value, right? And, especially when it comes to analytics, It's such a critical part of any organization's path forward and the numbers that you're just sharing from Gartner and other resources,
[00:05:51] where if the majority of the time is gone into the data collection, the data refinement, all that, there's no time left or a very minimal time for your analytics part, which makes it really difficult for organizations to make quick decisions. So I think what I'm hearing from you, the why: the time value becomes very important in this case.
[00:06:13] Shawn Brown: Correct. Absolutely.
[00:06:16] Mustansir Saifuddin: That's good because that kind of takes me into this conversation, like, Hey, benefits. When you have that, why understood, what are some of the benefits that BDC will provide to SAP customers who want to go on the journey? Because benefits is really the reason why it will make sense for them to move forward.
[00:06:33] Shawn Brown: For sure, for sure. And this is the one that's always interesting for organizations because they're focused so much on the actual preparation of the data that oftentimes the benefits that they can glean from all of that effort are, are fleeting, so they look at the, the overall effort and they go, oh yeah, there's, there's a lot here that is really based on, on how much it took to get here.
[00:07:01] And the faster we can deliver the capabilities for analysis purposes for any AI purposes, the faster we can make decisions. The faster we can adjust based on those decisions. And so when you think about the speed at which organizations operate, to be able to answer those questions faster is probably the number one benefit that you can get.
[00:07:27] And then you also get into accuracy. What, what questions are we asking? And if we don't have to go through this rigorous effort of moving data from all of these source systems and joining it all back together, and then building all that business context. Data integrity, is that a, a concern? It is for most organizations, they're concerned about what this looks like at its end state.
[00:07:57] And the other thing that still [00:08:00] exists in the world of business, especially in the analytics space, is the typical spread marked problem. Where people just take the data that they're looking for, they extract it out of whatever solution it's been delivered to them. Maybe it's cheap cloud storage on flat files, or maybe it's been all dumped into an ODS, an operational data store, and then they're accessing the data as they like.
[00:08:26] If they don't understand the details of the data and the relationships that occur with the data, and they don't have the original business context that the data came from in its source system, then if they do extract it to whatever they like, then somebody can walk into a meeting with one version of the truth and another can walk in with another version of the truth.
[00:08:48] They all can believe that they're accurate. They all can argue over why their version of truth is correct and the others is not. So the confidence in the data is the other thing. We take away a lot of those concerns, because when you have it coming from those source systems and the preparation of that data has been provided in this case by SAP, for SAP systems, at a minimum, you're going to have much more confidence that the data
[00:09:17] is delivered to you in a way that respects all of the integrity that it came from. That the accuracy of the data is as accurate as it was entered into the business application upon which it was the source. So the speed of delivery, the accuracy of the data. These are, these are major advantages that you get with regards to using BDC versus
[00:09:43] the, the older school, I'll call it older school 'cause I'm an old guy. The old days of Bill Inman and star schemas and relational database systems that we created. These massive data warehouses. It's an older school thought, and it was one that was born outta this idea that we had to get the data from those source systems because we couldn't query the source systems at runtime.
[00:10:06] All those things contribute to, to today where we're curating the data for you. It's been curated by SAP from all SAP systems, so if you have any questions about the quality of the data, in that case, you then you should have questions about the quality of your data in its source. there's a bigger issue, so speed of delivery, accuracy of data.
[00:10:32] Those are probably my, my two top benefits that customers are going to get out of this.
[00:10:38] Mustansir Saifuddin: Absolutely. That makes total sense. I think one of the things that really stuck out for me was the whole concept of end-to-end governance . Does BDC do a better job? And how, is that integrated to this whole BDC realm of the different pieces that makes up BDC? How is data governance and security working within those parameters?
[00:11:03] Shawn Brown: Yeah. So in BDC, you're getting role level security on all the data. At that point then you're asking questions like, where do I, how do my users access the data? What are they allowed to see? What are they not allowed to see? All those capabilities can be integrated into BDC. You, you can deliver all of those capabilities directly within BDC.
[00:11:27] You start off by setting up some broader, who's the, who's the group? What systems are they accessing? So if I'm in finance and I'm looking at finance data, I probably have access to let's say S/4HANA as the backend system that is storing all this data. All the users within the finance team that have access to S/4HANA can have access to that space of data.
[00:11:55] And I use that word space because this is a concept that, again, there's nothing [00:12:00] new. We've invited these concepts into our thinking a while ago, and now it's just another generation of what we're doing here. So that idea of a space is I can include the data that is necessary for a line of business hr, finance, supply chain, and that's what they can see.
[00:12:20] And if I need to, all of the rest of the data is accessible through BDC. It's just a question of whether I want to provide the rights to access those other data sets to another line of business, for example. So if I said I wanted to join let's say expense information that's in Concur with employee information, that's in success factors, I can easily join those data sets
[00:12:48] bring in forward, from one space to another. And decide at a row level and column level, what individual data set I need to join across groups or individuals, if you will.
[00:13:06] Mustansir Saifuddin: I think that's super good because that's where a lot of the questions come in. You know, every time you do move your data from one environment to another environment that you need to have your own new set of governance and security and, it can be role level security or whatever else you wanna do,
[00:13:21] you have to kind of redefine that. It seems like it's all built into the BDC portfolio. You're leveraging your source system objects and then be able to apply the same rules that you may have built in.
[00:13:37] Shawn Brown: Yeah, the, the analogy I always liked was it's kind of like, and I don't know if they're really like this. I mean, maybe there are not. I just remember old movies that you'd have these Japanese styled homes and they were like, the walls that were almost paper thin, that you could, you almost felt like you could just push your hand right through the wall and just grab something that was in the other room.
[00:13:57] I liken it a bit like that in terms of spaces. The spaces are separated in that way with a, a level of access that is very simple to provide when necessary, but distinctly in separate spaces, separate areas, so that that's the benefit. That's the simplicity of being able to access data from any LOB or any third party for that matter.
[00:14:23] If you wanted to access that third party data in BDC to any other data that's in BDC as well, whether it's finance, hr, supply chain, whatever it may be, warehouse inventory, whatever it may be.
[00:14:38] Mustansir Saifuddin: Totally. Now, since we talked about the benefits, let's look into the details. Like what steps are involved if someone wants to take on this journey and move to SAP BDC?
[00:14:53] Shawn Brown: Much of that begins with where are they right now? Let's take a few different scenarios? if a customer is, let's say, already using some SAP solutions, I would say, let's go with the most rudimentary that has been around for a while now for SAP. Let's talk about, they're using HANA Enterprise.
[00:15:09] They've, they've been taking a lot of data from their SAP systems and dropping it into HANA Enterprise on-prem. This is a natural next step to that on-premise approach where you said, all right, I, I don't necessarily wanna be in the position of housing systems like this myself and my own data centers.
[00:15:28] I want to put them into the cloud. This is a simple transition , to take the data from a HANA Enterprise, drop it into BDC and start using that data in essentially what would be a component of BDC, Datasphere. But it's built on HANA Cloud. And HANA Cloud is built on the same technology that HANA Enterprise is built on that in terms of its capabilities, what it can do.
[00:15:52] It's a natural transition for that case if you're talking about a customer that's already using let's say another old product from [00:16:00] SAP, BW. Right. BW has been a really challenging one for a lot of organizations because they've had such value and such benefit by using BW to access data in SAP with those BW extractors.
[00:16:14] And in many cases, they've built a lot of and invested a lot in BW in the framework itself. Creating their own objects, creating their own cubes, creating asos, DSOs and so forth, depending on what versions of BW you're on. Not necessarily wanting to just abandon that investment. There's another great example of is, once you're, once you're at least BW 7.5 and above, we make it very simple for you to go ahead and take all of that in BW investment and move it directly into BDC in its format, in its same format as a BW environment.
[00:16:54] BW for HANA, same thing, move it right into BDC, it would be in a cloud-based environment that way as well. And essentially all of those connections back to the source systems still persist. When we talk about how do we take advantage of the investments you have, that's where you say, all right, well, I can access them through the BDC framework in
[00:17:16] BW that is now part of BDC and use it for whatever purpose I leave it in BW in that case, or I can start taking those particular assets that I have in BW and using the data product generator that is now part of BW embedded in BDC, I can then change those assets in BW to data products. Which is the lowest level form of data that we have in BDC, and in this case, just for those that may be listening and wondering, am I copying the data?
[00:17:51] Yes . And we can come to this in a minute as to why you're copying the data, but we are copying the data from its source system, and we would be copying the data from BW as well, where we wanted to make it a data product in BDC. And we can talk about why that is in a minute. 'cause it's a shift. It, it's a bit of a shift in terms of what we've talked about in the past with regards to a whole play the data where it lies, federate versus materialize
[00:18:18] that data in, what was Datasphere, which is now part of BDC. That idea of moving those assets from BW into BDC as data products, over time allows us to decommission those, those deployments of BW. So that's the benefit is, we now have a path for BW customers to migrate to BDC,
[00:18:45] not give up those assets that they've created and leveraged for so many years in BDC, and then over time decommission BW altogether. Or, if you're really interested and you really like using BW, keep it. That's the other benefit of moving a BW 7.5 environment to BDC is, you're gonna get three more years of mainstream maintenance.
[00:19:09] And for example, for BW/4HANA, we're pushing that end of life date all the way out to 2040. That's a long time that you can hold onto that BW environment if that's what you choose to do. But the benefit of BDC is that we're going to give you the mechanism to actually migrate it over and then as your backend systems, particularly like S4 changes,
[00:19:31] you're gonna need to change a lot of what you're doing from a BW extraction anyway. Don't do it in BW anymore. Do it in BDC. Now, those are some of the SAP scenarios, but some of the ones that I get as well are, we already have a strategy with our SAP data. We're pulling it into S3 buckets.
[00:19:55] Azure Data Factory, Snowflake , all of these third [00:20:00] party extraction destinations and why would I go ahead and use BDC in that case? And the reality is, you have to ask yourself this question where we started in the first place. How much time and energy are you spending going from data all the way around that wheel to analytics?
[00:20:20] If you're like the typical organization and it's north of 70%, 80%, 90% as a CIO, I heard last week talking about this, 90% of their time is spent just moving data to get it prepared for analysis. How much do you want to continue to do that? And nobody likes to be looked at as a cost center. Everybody likes to be seen as somebody that is providing value to the organization.
[00:20:50] If you're part of an organization and you are seen as a cost center, because the amount of energy it takes to get the data from where it sits to where it needs to be is exorbitant, nine tenths maybe of the overall cost of asking those questions. That's not a great place to be. If you can shrink that as much as possible, then you can actually live up to some of those things that everybody would like to say.
[00:21:19] Like, data is the new gold, data is the new oil. The value of data is, is immeasurable. We can do so much with our business because of the data. We could be a data-driven organization. All of these things can become possible, but not so easy when nine tenths or eight tenths of the cost, it's just getting the data where it needs to be.
[00:21:44] That's the big thing that needs to be focused on as it relates to some of these ideas that let's go ahead and do the, what I still call old school extract, transform, load, model, profile, catalog govern and, create all of the overhead that is necessary to actually deliver those analytics back to the organization.
[00:22:07] And if, you're in a part of your organization where you think it's good enough for me to just extract all the data and drop it over here and let the business go have fun, that's another one where you're not providing additional value to the organization.
[00:22:19] What the business community really wants is they want curated data that is business context aware, that is in a position to help them answer questions out of the box, push button. An actual software as a service. That's what we've got with BDC. So this idea that of you've already got a strategy in place,
[00:22:44] it might be working right now because you did a ton of work to get you where you are. But here's the kicker. It's probably all going to change, maybe not next year, but maybe two years or three years, maybe the next time you do some major upgrade and we've become more efficient in terms of how we store the data in the business applications, or,
[00:23:12] any of the other business applications that you use, they change their underlying architecture in how they are actually storing the data in those source systems. Guess what just changed with your data strategy? Potentially everything. And we have customers that this has happened to them. Where I've walked into a huge SAP customer and I had a conversation with him where I said, we're gonna go ahead, and this is before we had two separate entities of BDC and BTP. And I walked into this session with the customer and said, here's what we're gonna do.
[00:23:43] We're gonna go ahead and tell you everything that we can do in the space of data and analytics and everything within the platform space. And the customer said, I don't think we really need to hear about your data and analytics strategy, because we're pretty well set on that. And I said, I want to talk to you about all these things and I need to talk to you [00:24:00] about this one as well.
[00:24:01] This one's not negotiable. I need whoever's responsible for data and analytics to be in the room to discuss this. And that person did arrive and that person pretty much felt like they had everything figured out. They didn't wanna, engage in the conversation at all. Pretty much arms crossed throughout most of the most of the meeting.
[00:24:19] And we finally got to a point where they said, all right, I can see that there's some benefits, you know, to how this works. But I'll tell you, they were on ECC on HANA. And so fast forward six months and they're negotiating the RISE opportunity with S4/HANA in a private cloud and RISE, and they now realize that everything needs to be changed.
[00:24:50] It's good that we had this conversation with them about how you can access the SAP data through, at the time, Datasphere, which is now Business Data Cloud, because they now understand that for them to be able to get access to the data in the way they want, the fastest way they want, and for the fact that we're curating all that data for them, and then providing them out of the box insights with our insight apps.
[00:25:14] This is pretty much a no brainer in their part. They knew that they had to explore it, and they knew they had to explore it for the SAP centric question, but also for the non SAP centric question where they want to pull smaller data sets to non SAP capabilities because we are gonna curate those scenarios through data products that will allow them to pull that data into those non SAP scenarios.
[00:25:40] So this, these are some of the big plays, we've got that existing SAP solutions, we've got that non SAP centric approach. And then, ultimately, if you haven't got to the point that you're deciding what you're going to do or you haven't don't have a very mature data strategy, maybe you're a growing company, at some point you're going to need to go ahead and start asking those data and analytics questions.
[00:26:05] Just know that it's very expensive, as I've said before, to move the data from one place to another, place it there, do all of those things that we've talked about in the past, and then deliver analytics, just pull it out of the box. The last comment I'll make is "that pull it out of the box" sometimes that's not as useful as we think it is.
[00:26:25] If I said, you have to dig a hole, it's 10 feet deep and you started from ground level, you have 10 feet to dig. But if I gave you something that got you 50% of the way, I dug five feet for you, I dug six feet for you, would you rather just dig five more feet or four more feet, or would you just rather start from ground level and dig 10 feet on your own?
[00:26:48] That's the value that we were trying to demonstrate through BDC.
[00:26:53] Mustansir Saifuddin: Good explanation. And I think it is really clear that a lot of times conversations come up about SAP customers talking about their on-prem, their legacy systems and how they will benefit from BDC, but your examples went beyond HANA Enterprise to other non SAP solutions where customers have already been on the journey and they don't see the value at least at this point.
[00:27:20] But, after seeing the example you use, it's very logical for them to start thinking in those terms. Also saying, Hey, I simplify my landscape? Still get , if not same, at least, the value that whatever else that BDC brings to the table, like the whole AI capability, all of that can be leveraged by adopting this platform. On a personal note how do you stay on top of, you know, this changing technology world, and business at the same time. How you keep up with all this?
[00:27:58] Shawn Brown: Yeah, as you [00:28:00] might imagine in the space of SAP, oftentimes it's hard enough just staying on top of all of the different options we have and different things that we have in terms of technology. So one of the ways that I like to keep up in, in the SAP space is called the BTP Talk podcast, which is a pretty good one.
[00:28:18] It actually goes to a number of different you know, platform and data analytics related scenarios. Data skeptics is another pretty good podcast that I get a kick out of. There's another one I'm trying to think of that I use from time to time as well.
[00:28:32] Analytics Power Hour. That's it. Yeah, the Analytics Power Hour is another good one. And, I've been paying attention to Tech-Driven Business as well too, so I like this one too. But, you know, the thing that I've been finding too is that, these days, things move so quickly and we think we know where we're going and then something comes along and, and change makes us change direction again.
[00:28:53] And AI has probably been the biggest driver to that. The thing that I would say that that it's probably most interesting in terms of how I've changed how I operate is I actually ask AI to provide resources for me on particular topics. For example mid early last year there was a lot of talk about vector engines and knowledge graphs.
[00:29:14] And the easiest thing I found to really kind of get a little bit more, versed on the topics was AI itself. I started asking for resources and, and I'll use for example, ChatGPT in some cases I like using Grok as well. From time to time they seem to provide a little bit different types of approaches and levels of interaction.
[00:29:35] I kinda like how, grok will ask me follow up questions, which is pretty neat as well. But that's a great way to learn about topics that you are wanting to become more versed in or learning where the resources are to find those topics. So those, those are some of the things that I like to use.
[00:29:58] Mustansir Saifuddin: Great list of ideas to kind of keep up with the changing, I mean, just everywhere around us. taking from AI to just carries to anything else. A lot of conversations going on so many different directions. How do you even keep up with them? So I'd like your suggestions, and I know we've talked about a lot of different things today. What is the one thing or one takeaway that you want to leave our listeners with?
[00:30:24] Shawn Brown: Hmm, probably in, in the audience of that are responsible for data and analytics. If you're a CDAO, or an analyst or somebody that's responsible for enterprise wide analytics: I would focus on two things because these two things are probably the most important to the people that you serve, your business community.
[00:30:50] Point number one is, they want analytics quickly. They want to be able to ask questions quickly. They don't wanna wait. They don't want to say this report, these data sets that you've provided me, they look really interesting, but I'd like to add this and this and this, and when can I have that?
[00:31:12] If you can't say you can have that now, then you're taking too long. The other point is. We need to stop being looked at as a cost center. We need to stop being looked at as a place that is a necessary evil. We gotta ask questions of the system. We've gotta extract data everywhere and put it in someplace that we can start answering questions or even not even doing to the extent of actually providing the analytics out of the box.
[00:31:40] Instead, we're just providing data sets for people to access. We need to be able to offer real value to the business community. Those are the ones that are footing the bill. Those are the ones that are actually paying for everything. So we need to be in a position to deliver it very quickly, [00:32:00] and it needs to not be expensive, and it needs to be accurate.
[00:32:06] Mustansir Saifuddin: Absolutely
[00:32:07] Shawn Brown: Those are the elements I think are the key takeaways. That's really the foundation of what we're doing with Business Data Cloud. That's the whole purpose behind it.
[00:32:16] Mustansir Saifuddin: Absolutely great advice and a great way to sum up the session. It's been a great conversation. There's so much to gain from this product and, and direction, that SAP's taking. I'd like to thank you very much for joining us today in our show, and look forward to having further detailed conversation with you.
[00:32:36] Shawn Brown: Thanks, I appreciate your time as well.
[00:32:39] Mustansir Saifuddin: Thanks for listening to Tech-Driven Business, brought to you by Innovative Solution Partners. We have covered the critical why behind BDC, the immense time and cost savings it promises, and the tangible benefits like enhanced speed and accuracy for SAP customers. Sean's key takeaway? Focus on delivering analytics quickly to your business community and strive to offer real accurate value moving away from being seen as just a cost center.
[00:33:15] . We would love to hear from you. Continue the conversation by connecting with me on LinkedIn or X. Learn more about Innovative Solution Partners and schedule a free consultation by visiting isolutionpartners.com. Never miss a podcast by subscribing to our YouTube channel. Information is in the show notes.
