Yale, UT, and Everything in Between: Maoli Vizcaíno on Building a Career in Earth Science

What really goes into choosing a graduate program in the geosciences? In this episode, Yale PhD candidate Maoli Vizcaíno offers an honest look at the decisions that shape an academic career: from navigating funding and institutional support to choosing between a master’s and a PhD.

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Transcript

Choosing Between UT Austin and Yale

[00:36:33] Diya Gaur: So what made you choose between like, okay, well, what were the things that you were considering when you had to pick between UT, Austin, and Yale? Like, what were the maybe different things in terms of, you know, academics or resources? What exactly drew you to Yale over UT? 

[00:36:48] Maoli Vizcaíno: Yeah, so, um I think it was, it was a couple things.

Uh, both were by my family. So it was by my dad and it was by my sister. So I was like, great. UT, uh, the professor, he, um, had a project that I could go in. For the first couple of years. And that was really attractive to me because I had never come up with my own research project before yet. So I was like, that'll be great to like, have something that I know I'm doing while I'm, you know, getting everything settled and like starting this program, you know, versus at Yale, I knew I'd have to come in and figure it out.

[00:37:24] : And that was 

[00:37:25] Maoli Vizcaíno: intimidating to me. Um, but I, you know, I felt both, both professors who I was looking at were people who like, I had heard a lot about from, you know, other people and like, you know, I think it's always important to like. Oh, and as a side note too, like, unsolicited advice you didn't ask me, but I will say if, you know, you are interested in going in, I would definitely, if you haven't already, like, think about where you would be able to do research.

I think that if someone wants to do geology, like, undergrad research is, like, extremely important. I think more And then in other fields where it's kind of a given that you're not like gonna always be like, have done biology research or like, if you're pre pre med or whatever, because it's like, why, you know, lots of dangerous things going on.

I don't, I don't know. I don't know anything about pre med, but for geology, I think, you know, you know, thinking about where, where schools, you will be able to like, talk to professors, gain a real relationship with a couple of them, like work in their labs for real, for real. Like, I think that's a huge, huge thing.

Like, something you should think about. For sure. But yeah, so research wise, that was it. Um, I ended up choosing Yale, um, because, um, one, is I knew that I was going to be coming in with another student. So I knew that my, um, the professor, my professor here at Yale, she was also recruiting another student, so there were two of us.

And so, um. I talked to her and she was like, I'm probably gonna go. She was actually also choosing between UT and Yale. Oh wow, interesting. She was looking at biology at UT and then obviously, but yeah. So then she was like, I think I'm going to go Yale. And I was like, okay, if I go to Yale, I'll be going with someone.

And I love having a buddy, like I love commiserating. And I was like, pretty sure I would be the only student coming into the other lab. And then, um, UT. UT really did me dirty. So I did liberal arts undergrad, but I also did a master's. I remember they were like, um, you don't have the correct prereqs from undergrad for the program.

So you'd have to take an extra class to fulfill those prereqs. And the professor I was applying with, he was like, she has a master's degree, like, who cares if she missed one science class in undergrad, like, you don't have the pre reqs. So that was another thing that was kind of like, I was like, okay, so I'm going to have to, if I go to UT, I'm going to have to take an extra class, undergrad, like, come on, that was so long ago.

So that was a bummer. And then also in the end, like Yale, like money, honestly, they offered me so much money, like so much. Right. And I think that's a huge thing. That's, I think there are so many amazing, like, public schools, state schools, et cetera, but private schools have levels of resources, and I feel like, in my experience, with less red tape, um, obviously everything's a bureaucratic mess, but it's like so much Easier, I, again, in my experience, to like just have funding for stuff like I did for undergrad and then public school for my master's.

And then at Stanford, going and then seeing again, like, cause I had forgotten after two years what private school was like, seeing it happen again. I was like, right, like, this is huge. I'm going to be born for six years. Like, I want money. So yeah, so that was it. It was like having a buddy, being close to my sister.

And the money. 

[00:40:40] Diya Gaur: So does Yale fund the research that you do or is it like other organizations that are kind of like, you know, funding your projects and, you know, so on? 

[00:40:49] Maoli Vizcaíno: Um, so Yale does do a stipend for all of the, um, GSAS, Graduate School of Arts and Sciences. So if you're in the professional schools, like the law school, the business school, nursing school, you're paying.

PhD vs Master's Programs: Funding and Stipends

[00:41:00] Maoli Vizcaíno: Um, but for the PhD programs and the mass and the master's programs that are not, That are not professional schools. Actually, don't quote me on the master's schools. I don't know about that. The master's programs. The PhD programs, you get paid. Um, so we get a stipend. It's like a regular salary. Like, I get a check times a year.

Actually, a year. Oh my god. Two times a month. Um. Yeah, and we just unionized, like, last year, I think, so the stipends have all increased, so we're making, like, 49, 000 a year. 

[00:41:30] Diya Gaur: Oh, okay, so that's pretty good, yeah. Yes, it is, 

[00:41:34] Maoli Vizcaíno: especially with, like, what it used to be, and even still, like, we were always making the higher end as STEM students, like, the humanities students were making, like, almost, like, 10k lower than us before the union, so that was, like, crazy.

But yeah, so they pay us, and then you can get cut, like, extra money, kind of, from like different fellowships and things. There is a cap, um, I think you can make like four thousand more dollars if you get like an external fellowship, like that's the amount extra, and then everything else like just goes to the school and like you get your accolades and everything, but there is kind of a level of like a, of a cap on how much like you can make.

I see. And we're not allowed to work, um, have other jobs, like we, um, I think it's. You can't have another job, but it can't be more than 10 hours a week. I see. Yeah, so it's like I teach high schoolers after school. Oh, that's sweet. Yeah, it's like an after school program. 

Balancing Outreach and Graduate Studies

[00:42:30] Maoli Vizcaíno: And that's another thing too, you mentioned like outreach before, and I will say that is something that I feel like is a lot easier as a grad student than an undergrad.

You really are so busy in undergrad, like with all the homework and all the clubs and like you're trying to get, you're trying to get everything together, you know what I mean? And in grad school, it's like, obviously you are still like really busy, um, and lots going on, but it's all like the same thing, you know, it's like.

And like, once you get a handle on that, then it's like, you start feeling like, I'm saying you, me. You know, I mean, I came in knowing that that's something I wanted to do. And then the first two years, I was like, Oh my God, 

[00:43:05] : like, you know, 

[00:43:06] Maoli Vizcaíno: my third year, I started going back to like, you know, the things I wanted to do, like, we have the museum here and I knew I wanted to work with them and do outreach with kids and stuff.

And I've really not really kind of settled into that now in my fourth year. So it took a bit, but I, you know, I was like, this is something I knew I wanted to do. And I was like, I don't want to get lost in like, you know, like the research of it all. And, you know, and like, that's cool, but you know, it's, it's not, it's kind of, it can get kind of soulless, you know.

[00:43:33] Diya Gaur: No, yeah, like, for sure. Go ahead. Sorry, go ahead. No, actually, 

[00:43:35] Maoli Vizcaíno: I don't, I didn't have anything else to say on that. No, 

Differences Between Master's and PhD Programs

[00:43:38] Diya Gaur: yeah, I was just gonna ask, so what are, like, the key differences in the master's versus PhD programs in your experience, like, specifically for geology, you know? I mean, I know you mentioned funding is one thing, but is there anything different, like, curriculum wise or just, like, research wise, like, any limitations?

[00:43:56] Maoli Vizcaíno: Yeah, I'd say, and in very general strokes, I'd say the So the master's will be, you know, two years. And I'd say often you'll get, like, I was paid for my master's coming in. I came in on a grant to do a specific thing that my advisor had come up with, do that for two years. And at the same time, I'm taking classes.

And then like your last year, you're like not really taking classes and you're like doing more writing and you write your, your thesis, um, and like completing this research project. So I'd say the master's, it's a lot more like, you know what you're doing. You come in, like, They tell it like, you know what classes you need to take, you probably have a res like a project defined for you, so you can just start working on it.

Versus the PhD in my field in the U. S., I would say five to six years is pretty, is pretty standard. Um, five more than six, but in a lot of programs six years, especially since the pandemic. Um, but yeah, so that it's definitely a lot more loosey goosey, like. I have heard your first two years set classes and then sometime at some point in like, depending on the program, first, second or third year, you're taking your qualifying exam, which is like this big test.

It's like this big oral exam. Some people even have a written part or like, it's just your committee asking. You think you present to them, they ask you questions and like, you just need to prove that you know all this stuff. And then they're trying to figure out everything that you don't know. So they'll keep going and then you'll probably cry.

And then it'll be over. They tell you if you pass or not. Um, and then after that, you're a PhD candidate. And then from there, it is just dissertation writing. Like you're doing your own research. You're kind of expected to kind of be like more independent, like just kind of going and doing stuff, doing your check ins and whatever.

But like, you know, kind of, you know, Starting to, to be really independent. Yeah, 

[00:45:54] Diya Gaur: I see. 

Deciding Between a Master's and a PhD

[00:45:55] Diya Gaur: So, okay, so for someone who's like just going into geology or maybe just pursuing it as an undergrad, how do they decide, like, how far in the, you know, grad schooling process they want to go? Like, you know, what are the benefits of doing, like, Maybe a master's compared to a PhD or maybe just doing a master's in something completely different like maybe business or medicine?

[00:46:15] Maoli Vizcaíno: Yeah, that's a really good question. I think it definitely depends on, you know, what you want to do. If you want to go and like professor route, you got to do the PhD. Um, you can, you can, like, adjunct with a master's, I think, in some places, but that's not, like, a livable wage, so I wouldn't recommend doing that.

Um, yeah, so I have a friend, one of my friends from UD, she stopped at the master's, and she works for, well, she works for USGS, and now she works for the EPA, and, like, that's fine, so, like, industry, for industry jobs, you can get away with a master's for a lot of it, and then it's just more, like, the pay scale at that point, that's, like, you know, if you have a PhD.

I don't know. So PhD, issues with getting the PhD is that you can be overqualified for things from like the degree standpoint, but also underqualified in that like you know some like niche thing really well like not really translatable to like anything besides professor stuff so like i knew from the jump i don't want to go into academia and that's like in my interviews and stuff i was saying that and there's a lot of like okay well then why are you doing this if like you don't it's like well i like doing research and i'm gonna get paid for it if i do this so like i want to do that but it's i probably you know need to be prepared to like Maybe not see how far I can get without mentioning that as a PhD, you know, when I'm applying to something in industry, especially like if it's like not in a government position, like at a company or something, you know, like, cause people like, there is kind of this perception that it's like, you can kind of, you are really good at like one thing or, you know, only know one thing, but like, they love to like pound into our heads all the time.

They're like, as a PhD student, you have, You gain so many other skills, like project management, working with people, communication, presentations, verbally and orally. You learn how to write, you learn how to do research, troubleshooting, depending on what kind of work you do, you learn all sorts of instruments, how to use them, like safety protocol, literally so much stuff.

So, you know, and, and it's just at that point, it's like, you need to know how to spin, which I feel like I can do my ability to spin. But yeah, so you know, it's it really just Yeah, I think I think getting a master's is like really great for like so many things. Yeah, so I don't know. I think it would just depend on that.

It's like if you want to go into government or industry, I think a master's is totally great for that. Professor, you kind of have to do the PhD. And I don't know, if you have a PhD, you can also do lots of things, but like you might also be kind of putting yourself in a position where people don't know what to do with you.

[00:48:54] Diya Gaur: Yeah, no, I see that for sure. That is definitely a dilemma. I mean, for me, I just know that I want to do like maybe a bachelor's in geology, but I think for me where the main problem lies is just kind of figuring out what to do after that. I know it's kind of early, but you know, to make these types of plans, it's never too early.

But like, you know, I remember Maybe freshman year, I was stressing out about, like, what I wanted to do in college, and looking back, what I wanted to do initially was medicine, and, you know, over the course of four years, it suddenly changed, well, not suddenly, but it gradually changed over to geology, and so, you know, I think also the experience that people get from their undergrad, and, like you said, the importance of doing research in the undergrad, that definitely dictates a lot of You know, what people choose to end up pursuing for graduate schooling, and so I think that's what you said was very important to consider in context as well, so for sure.

Research and Career Paths in Geology

[00:49:50] Diya Gaur: How would you describe the overall environment of being a PhD candidate at Yale? Is there anything specific in terms of the EPS department or geology, the community specifically? 

[00:50:03] Maoli Vizcaíno: Um, I, I mean, it's interesting, you know, every, every place has its things. 

[00:50:10] Diya Gaur: Do you do, like, a lot of intermingling with the other geology or EPS majors?

Oh, yeah, 

[00:50:16] Maoli Vizcaíno: yeah. Well, I started, well, I started, we were still doing, like, virtual stuff. So, like, my first year was still, like, lots of, like, Zoom class and stuff. But, like, second year onward, it's been, like, more, um, yeah, I see, you know, we have, like, a whole hallway, it's, like, the grad wing, where we're, all of our offices are in there.

So, I'll sit on the wall, get bored, take a walk, and go bother someone. Um, yeah, you know, I, I, I love my friends, I have friends, like, in my lab, and then also in other labs, too, and we do lots of stuff 

[00:50:42] Diya Gaur: together. Mm hmm. 

[00:50:43] Maoli Vizcaíno: Yeah. Mm hmm. 

[00:50:45] Diya Gaur: Could you remind me, like, specifically where in Texas you're from? I'm from Fort Worth.

From Texas to the Gulf of Mexico: Research Journeys

[00:50:51] Diya Gaur: Okay, cool, so I did have this question initially, but I was wondering, so you were talking about all these different places, like, you know, about like, getting seasick and, you know, fieldwork, and so, as I went through your profile earlier, like, before our podcast episode that we're recording now, I was seeing that you also do work in The Gulf of Mexico and also the Caribbean, or you research those places specifically, and so I was wondering how did you make that change from, you know, being in Texas and then pursuing research in those like very specific places?

[00:51:24] Maoli Vizcaíno: Yeah, so um, I was, Always interested in that area. I'm Dominican, so I like, in terms of like, as an ocean scientist, I'm like, yeah, like, I want to do that. Like, the dream is to, like, find a way to, like, do work, like, over there and, like, here and, like, be, like, you know, do a back and forth thing and have that kind of be, like, an area that I Work in, um, more long term so that I can also, like, it'll be great, like, you know, going to see family and stuff, but yeah, so with the Gulf of Mexico, I mentioned earlier, like, the data set I got that I based my first project around was from this really amazing long term data set that some colleagues collected in the Gulf of Mexico that they just did not have the, you know, they're like, we don't really have the bandwidth right now to like, kind of process all this, like, if you don't mind.

And so it's been really great. I've learned a lot of stuff through this and I extended the Caribbean like for myself. I will say that since writing that bio, things have changed as they do. So I'm, my second project is less on that. And it's more on Kind of this like global data set, um, still near and dear to my heart and like something I want to maybe for project three or something.

Get into. But yeah, and in terms of, you know, the area, it's like, yeah, I don't know, the Gulf of Mexico, it's like, okay, yes, we were like landlocked in Fort Worth, but still, you know, it reminds me of home, like, um, I like thinking about the South. So yeah. 

[00:52:57] Diya Gaur: Have you done like any research specifically in Texas yet?

[00:53:01] Maoli Vizcaíno: No, I haven't. I don't even really know what the rocks are like in Texas. I was like, oh no, my geo knowledge came after. And like my field camp I did when I was abroad. Um, so it was like a joint, it was like, though it was like a geo program, so it was like had field camp at the beginning and then the abroad after, so that was great for killing like two birds.

[00:53:20] : Mm hmm. 

[00:53:21] Maoli Vizcaíno: Because it was like, it was like when I, when I left, I was just trying to go, my sister went to college in upstate New York, so she was there, so when I was looking at colleges I was like, I'm gonna go far away and also be close to her, so like, that was kind of like that, like what made me go over there.

And then so from there, like all my. Different, you know, scientific interests formed and like me coming back to like Gulf Mexico, Texas adjacent stuff is more of like, cause I'm like, it's so funny. It's like the longer I'm away, the more annoying I am. I am one of those Texans. Everybody knows I'm from Texas.

[00:53:52] Diya Gaur: Yes. Love Texas. Everyone needs to know that I'm a Texan. Like Texas alone. 

[00:53:57] Maoli Vizcaíno: Yeah. I was like, okay, we'll ignore the fact that I hated it so bad growing up because now I'm an adult now. I'm like, no, I'm from Texas. I have a shirt. I have the boots. I'm from Texas. Yelling at everybody. Buckies. No, exactly. Exactly.

[00:54:11] Diya Gaur: I dunno how people live without Buckys. Like, I'm just wondering, when I go off to college, if I end up going outta state, what am I gonna do without buckies? Oh my gosh. I don't even wanna think about it. But

yeah, I think that's one thing. And also. 

Making Geosciences Accessible to High School Students

[00:54:27] Diya Gaur: So I found you initially from the Geobiology conference at Yale, and so I'm going to AGU in December, and that's initially how I kind of did a bit more research on all these different types of conferences in Geobiology, and more specific to what I wanted to do in college, and so I was just wondering, from your standpoint, what's one thing that we could do Or maybe multiple things that we can do in order to make the geosciences a bit more accessible to high school students.

[00:54:54] Maoli Vizcaíno: Yeah, that is such a good question, because you told me. No, um, I mean, I think what you were saying earlier was really great, like, it's just, like, knowing everything that you can do with it, like, with the high schools I teach, we, like, are always emphasizing, like, how things can be, like, and we literally had, like, two jobs, like, this activity where they were, like, One word was bio like, it was like just different, like, fields.

Biologists, archaeologists, oceanographer, like, all this stuff, like, psychology, like. linguistics and like we gave them two of them and we're like tell us some reason why these two people would talk to each other what's something that they could learn about or not learn about what's something that they have in common that they could like do or like put together you know and we had kids like trying to like holding up like physicists and linguists is like okay well how can and then there's easier ones like chemistry and like Like, biology, and like, that's like, easier to do, but you know, things like that, just like, literally trying to, like, stare at them, and like, make them, like, make these connections, and how all these things, like, yes, we like, put people in boxes, like, bio major, whatever, chem major, but it's like, it's like, it is all, There is connections everywhere.

People do all sorts of things at the same time constantly. And it's really just for, you know, bureaucratic reasons that it's like you pick like one box, you know, it's like, but it's like, there's so much going on. And like, even like, With you as a person, it's the same way, you know, you're not just, you know, you're not just a woman, you're not just from Connecticut, you're not just, you know, any of these things, you're all sorts of things.

Um, those are that as well. I think, um, trying to do, like, as much hands on stuff as possible is always a good bet. Like, and we have the program, like, in the museum, so all of our lessons plans end with them, like, doing something in, in the galleries. 

[00:56:43] : Mm 

[00:56:43] Maoli Vizcaíno: hmm. So, yeah. It's tough though, because it's also like, it's not just about cool, you know, a lot of these kids are really, are extremely pragmatic, you know, they're like, they, you know, they know that they need to grow up and that they need to make money, so it's like, not like ignoring, like, it's not just, life is not just about what you're passionate about and about what you like doing, you know, so understanding that and also treating them like people who have Concerns for the future, you know, like, so like being straight up, I told him about my, like, my friend, I was like, she works for the EPA.

Here's the things that she does. Here's what her day to day life is. Here's how much she makes. Like, if they don't know, why would they aspire to it? Especially if something as random as earth science, you know? Um, or even environmental science. It can sound interesting, but what does that mean? You know, they don't know what that means, aside from the fact that they're scared of climate change.

Like, but yeah, anyway, so yeah, I think it's just like being like, I don't know, more, I feel like more information is always better. And like, being like, just not afraid to talk about things like, how much is this person making? How much school does this take? Is it okay to like, not, like, I always emphasize how I had no idea what I was doing until my sophomore year of college.

[00:57:56] : And I 

[00:57:56] Maoli Vizcaíno: took this job because I needed money, not because I thought the rocks were cool. Like later, you know, cause it was like, I was working with them and I started being like, well, what's all this about anyway, you know? And from there, and my advisor, she didn't care either. She didn't need me to be passionate, to dissolve these rocks.

I think your body struggles a lot with that. Like everyone's always so like, Oh, and you just love it. And you're so obsessed with it. And I was like, no, like. I love what I do, but I don't love it more than I love money. You know what I mean? I'm not going to be poor my whole life to study these guys. Now, um, yeah, and I think that, you know, just being 

[00:58:31] Diya Gaur: realistic is 

[00:58:33] Maoli Vizcaíno: huge.

I feel like it's huge for, like, younger students now, you know? There's like so much doom and gloom and it's like, okay, I'm being realistic and not in a broke the rest of your life way, but it's like, here's ways that 

[00:58:44] : you can be 

[00:58:45] Maoli Vizcaíno: broke doing this, but here's ways that you can be not broke. It is possible.

[00:58:49] Diya Gaur: Yeah. You know, I feel like not many people talk about that aspect of geology especially. I feel like, so my dad, he is in medicine now, like he's a doctor, but he was initially doing research and it was not very well paying for him and that's why he decided to take that one step up to go into medicine and pursue that.

But you know, not many people like, like to talk about that aspect of geology, just like, you know, the money sides of things and when I talk to people about it the majority of people that I hear from who are like, Have graduated with degrees in geology. They say, you know, I was like super passionate about it You know all these like really amazing things about geology But we never learned if there's like any of those more economic or financial motivations behind there as well and so I think yeah, that's a really good point and you also did mention earlier about like inclusivity and like That's like another, like, really, really major point, especially in the geosciences, you know, a couple of years ago, maybe like a couple of decades, like, the picture or the ideal geologist was maybe Indiana Jones, um, pardon me, Indiana Jones white men, but Yeah.

I think now what we're trying to like achieve is a bit more diversity and inclusivity in the field, and I think that's really important for sure. 

[01:00:03] Maoli Vizcaíno: Yeah, and there's like studies on that too, it's like in like science fields, geology is literally like in like Last place or maybe site. It's like in terms of, um, diversity, there's been like no changes in the demographic in like decades.

Yeah. And that's something that's real too. Like it's not, it is not easy for that to like kind of be the reality all the time. 

[01:00:29] Diya Gaur: Right. Yeah. So. Do you specifically teach earth sciences to the high school students? Is it specifically earth sciences? Is it like interdisciplinary? What exactly are you teaching?

Yeah, no, it's, 

[01:00:41] Maoli Vizcaíno: um, it's, it's, it's interdisciplinary. It's like more STEM. I, of course, always, like, am really biased when it does get to earth science. I loved it, and they know. And I'm like, hey, you know, it's cooler than anything we've ever learned. Like, you know, kidding around. But, um, yeah, no, so it's all sorts of stuff.

So it's fun for me, too, because I spend a lot of time, you know. I'm thinking about, again, like, you know, just this, and I forget sometimes that there's other fields. 

[01:01:05] Diya Gaur: Yeah. Do you mind name dropping the program? 

[01:01:08] Maoli Vizcaíno: Oh, oh yes, um, it is Yale Peabody, it's an evolutions program. 

[01:01:14] Diya Gaur: Okay, I see. 

[01:01:15] Maoli Vizcaíno: It's through the, yeah, it's through the museum.

Um, they apply, and we assess, like, their general interests in science. So it doesn't have to be anything, like, super crazy, super specific, you know, but it's just, like, 

[01:01:26] : Right. Um, 

[01:01:27] Maoli Vizcaíno: but yeah, no, and I can, yeah, and like, talk to you about that anytime you want. Also, um, I will, um, I'll also be at AGU, so. 

[01:01:36] Diya Gaur: Oh, you will?

Oh my god, perfect! Yeah, yeah, 

[01:01:38] Maoli Vizcaíno: I'll be there. 

[01:01:39] Diya Gaur: Can definitely be. My poster presentation is on December 14th. It's like the Bright Stars program, so. 

[01:01:46] Maoli Vizcaíno: That's awesome. Are you going to be there the whole time or just the 14th? 

[01:01:50] Diya Gaur: I think, so it kind of just depends, um, I'll definitely be there the 14th, but as for the weekend, we'll see, because I was thinking of touring a couple of colleges as well, so yeah, because I'm already up there and 

[01:02:03] : I 

[01:02:03] Diya Gaur: think it's a good opportunity for sure.

So I did have something to ask, but I forgot what exactly it was. Oh, okay. It was the hands on stuff. So I was gonna say, one, it's really good that Yale is promoting like earth sciences to high school students, and especially with the hands on stuff, I feel like we don't get enough of that in terms of accessibility for high school students.

So for me, I have GeoForce Texas, which is obviously with UT Austin, and we're going out and seeing all these different Rock formations, like, in real life, but I feel like that is severely overlooked in, like, other programs, and, frankly, I don't know any programs outside of GeoForce that really promote the earth sciences or just geology specifically, and I think if we really want people to care about the earth, like, Be the next generation of people who are kind of like, combating the climate change crisis.

It's really essential that we expand upon those opportunities and make it more accessible. Like, for me personally, I just felt really bad, because I, one, I just love the geosciences in general. It's just, like, overall, it's So much just stuff that you can learn about, but two, I don't really know, okay, this kind of goes back to what I just said, like I don't really know any programs outside of GeoForce, and so I feel like making geology a bit more accessible to people across the United States or even the world is like such a big thing that we can do in order to just like, kind of like hand off that big burden of climate change and make it a bit more pressing for the next generation to kind of take care of, because I feel like for people who are maybe Gen X, Gen Y, it's not as much of their problem as it, as it is like for the problem of Gen Z, it's really now in our hands to solve it.

Challenges and Realities of Climate Change Outreach

[01:03:51] Diya Gaur: And so, you know, I'm kind of surprised that there's not too much of talk about this specifically, like, about how we desperately need people to help Fight against climate change. Like, obviously there's climate activists, but we need people who are working behind the scenes and not just doing activism to stop it.

So, yeah. 

[01:04:09] Maoli Vizcaíno: Yeah, no, it's, it's tough. It's tough. Like, I get it. I get it from, I, I, it's, it's just, yeah, because it's like, you know, grad students are like so overworked and so are professors and like, there's so much, it's like you really have to fight against climate change. Like I was saying earlier, like getting caught up in like your work and what you're doing, because that's the other thing too.

In a lot of, in a lot of instances, it's like, you're really not, it's about what your output is and like less about like the, you know, the impact to some like kids, you know what I mean? But it can be really hard to feel like that sort of thing is a priority when you're in the thick of it. And you always think that at the next step, that's where you're really going to do it.

Like, Yeah, and it was like, for me, I remember I was like, starting my third year, I was like, yo, like, I've been here for two and a half years, like, what is going on, all the stuff that I wrote in my application that I wanted to do, like, I'm always like, oh, next semester, next semester, and I'm like, nah, like, it needs to start, like, being, like, a real thing, and like, So it's tough because it's like, I agree, it's like, it's like outreach and showing people what's possible and telling them what's happening is so important.

And it is so, it is hard. It is hard to be out there and spending time doing it too and coming up with stuff and then like, you know, I don't know. So yeah, it's, it's, it's tough. But no, I think you're totally right. I think you're totally right. Yeah. 

[01:05:32] Diya Gaur: Do you have any questions for me, by the way? I feel like I've been asking you a lot.

Yeah, 

[01:05:36] Maoli Vizcaíno: no, no. I mean, I do, like, you, so do you feel like, I mean, you've talked about, like, geo bio, but then also geology, like, do you feel like more of a rocky type of person, or more like, Or like, you know, like hard rock stuff or like soft rock. That's, that's what we would say, like, what, yeah, what sorts of things are you, like, kind of interested in potentially, like, I mean, you said like ice sheet things or thermal with ice sheets and stuff, like, I don't know.

Mhm. 

[01:06:06] Diya Gaur: I feel like there's, okay, this is definitely something I'm going to get a bit more clarity of when I get into college next year. So, I'm a senior this year, but really initially, kind of where that spark came from for me was, yeah, during the pandemic, like, maybe the 9th grade year. It wasn't specifically on a GeoForce trip, but I was hiking in Mount Rainier, and like I said, that first kind of connection I made to it was, I was, you know, drinking the glacier water and kind of like privately wondering what bacteria was like lurking inside of it.

And you know, I was just like kind of fascinated by that aspect and from there it's one Google search kind of led into another and that's where my first like fascination in the field of I guess geology specifically and then kind of just like tying that into biology a bit later came from and that was like the first instance where I was like in person seeing this like amazing like geological formation like Mount Rainier.

For me, that was like, just like, it was such an awe, like how should I describe it, like just like jaw dropping for me, like just being in front of Mount Rainier, like being in the Cascades and the Ring of Fire. But you know, it wasn't until my 11th grade year, like maybe two years after I went to Mount Rainier, where I actually like studied the geological processes of the Cascades and also the Ring of Fire specifically on my GeoForce trip.

And so we learned about, like, all these different types of metamorphic rock, and, you know, we went on these crazy obsidian trails in Washington State and Oregon. And I was like, you know, this is something I would genuinely, like, love doing, like, I definitely see myself doing this in the future. But, you know, at that point in time, I didn't really have any hands on experience when it came to research, and for me, I was like, in order to get, like, a bit more clarity as to if I really want to commit to doing this, I kind of need that more, like Solid clarification that this is what I genuinely enjoy doing and, you know, as time, like, time went on I found a lot of different intersections between, like, geology and biology and, as I mentioned earlier, like, initially when I went into high school I was, like, dead set on going into medicine but, you know, this kind of changed when I really just like, did stuff, like, experienced it with GeoForce, like, we went to, um, the Grand Canyon, we studied all the laws of superposition, and we did all of that, different, like, types of stuff, like, just studying those very specific geological formations and how they came to be and what the real life implications of it are.

I mean, that ties into a lot of that research which I ended up doing at UT, especially with the interplanetary, like, exploration, so it's, like, You know, I kind of, like, channeled back off of, like, that glacier stuff, which I learned from the Cascades and Mount St. Helens, Mount Hood, Mount Rainier, and, you know, obviously I had that fascination for glaciers, but what if we took it one step, like, greater, like, what if we kind of thought out of the box and did something which not many people would, at least in GeoForce, really consider, and so I was working on a team with my mentor, who, like, Dr.

Benjamin Kiesling, he is a like, 

[01:09:11] Maoli Vizcaíno: oh, I know him. 

[01:09:13] Diya Gaur: Oh, you know him? Yeah, yeah, yeah, 

[01:09:15] Maoli Vizcaíno: I do. 

[01:09:15] Diya Gaur: Yes. So he was my mentor and also, uh, my, my Kayla, I forget where, Pasquale, Pasquale. Okay. I hope I'm not saying that wrong, but so I'm kind of name dropping here, but so I was in his lab and I was doing definitely like, More lab based stuff, like, we weren't going out into the field or anything, but I learned how to do, like, Python models, and so, for me, I really like that aspect of, like, coding, so that was the first time I ever, like, coded in Python, and I was like, okay, so there's really multiple connections that you can make, one between geology, two between technology, and three between, like, Biology, which is my initial interest.

And so, taking that glacier stuff one step further, I studied the western Antarctic ice sheet, and we were like, kind of seeing these connections between how, like, the southern Mars ice cap kind of had some resemblance to the Antarctic ice sheets, and From there we were trying to see is there really any real world or like real implication that we can find based off of our modeling in Antarctica, like using all these different factors like geothermal heat flux, you know, ice density, like in the depth and so on and I mean, I'm in the International Baccalaureate program and so for me, it's like also taking those things that we're researching to the next level.

On a more like global scale like kind of thinking in a more issues type of way so for me it was like okay so what exactly are we getting out of studying the western antarctic ice sheet and then applying it to a different planet like Mars like is that within our tech is that capable are we capable of doing that given the technology that we have and like experience and if we do have like a finding which kind of proves our hypothesis like will it means that there's like some broader implication that we can do as in for like space exploration or like finding human settlement on mars and so we kind of like deduce that maybe if there were like really good like technology technology methods of like extracting some of the h2o from the southern mars ice sheet that it could be possible that I'm not sure how much human life could settle there potentially, but obviously it's like really difficult because, you know, it's a carbon dioxide, um, it's carbon dioxide ice basically, like that's the composition, and 15 percent of it is water, so.

In the long run, is that really sustainable, given how much, like, humanity depends on water? I don't really know, but, you know, that was kind of, like, one step in that investigation, and, you know, I learned a lot from that, because, honestly, our initial hypothesis was wrong, and so, I think, you live and you learn, especially, so, for me, like, that was, I wouldn't say it was a humbling moment, but, you know, And a lot of the academic stuff that I've done in high school so far, it's like you kind of give a hypothesis that's kind of like really easy and you kind of know will be correct in the end.

So this was my first like time having a hypothesis that was like completely wrong and so we find something completely different out and so for me that's like kind of why I like that more like researchy side and you know, kind of just like studying those like implicated things. Implications and yeah.

[01:12:13] Maoli Vizcaíno: Yeah, yeah, that's, I mean, that sounds like a really, like, yeah, it sounds like the process was really It is, yeah, it's funny, like, it can be fun when you're wrong, because then it's like, what is Well, then what is it then? And like, right. I hear you though. I hear you though. It's like, it's like you can, especially after a while, it's like, you kind of like, you know, have your guesses on where things are going to go.

And like, you can be like, you can be like pretty right. And but then it's like, Oh, just kidding. Or they have this other thing or someone's like, Oh, like, but have you considered this? And you're like, Oh no, like, it's always more complicated than you think it is. And like, I don't know. That's fine. But Oh, nice.

Yeah. That sounds awesome. That sounds awesome. You've done already a lot of cool things. 

[01:12:57] Diya Gaur: Thank you. Yeah, actually, I did have one final question. Like, I don't want to keep you for too long either, because I know we're already at one hour. 

Event Planning and Coordination in Academia

[01:13:03] Diya Gaur: But so how did you specifically end up like, planning things that just like the geobiology conference at Yale?

Like, is there something specifically that kind of drew you into like, That type of side of event planning and coordination. Yeah, 

[01:13:16] Maoli Vizcaíno: no, it's, uh, so it's the Northeast GeoBioSymposium. It happens every other year, every other year, every year. I don't remember. And so someone hosts it and it, it was our turn. 

[01:13:29] : I 

[01:13:30] Maoli Vizcaíno: see.

I, um, I'm such a joiner. I love doing things. You know, and I'm like, I am, you know, I'm, I'm more in my saying no era, but this was like, you know, they, they did need a lot of help, like putting on something like that is a really big undertaking, but yeah, so one of my, like, so we, in, in our program, we do like a major project and a minor project.

So my minor project advisor, she was like kind of the professor in charge. And so she literally emailed us, she emailed like five of us, she was like, Hey y'all, so you're going to be on the organizing committee for this. 

[01:14:05] : Figure out 

[01:14:05] Maoli Vizcaíno: what jobs you're taking and put this on. And so it was, yeah, it was, it was definitely big, big learning experience also, like what goes behind the scenes on this sort of thing.

So, yeah, it's, but it's like, it's something that like rotates, it rotates through different schools. I went to that as an undergrad cause I was in Massachusetts. So like, I went, um, I went as an undergrad twice and like, I was like, Oh my God, we're back. And I went like my first year here. It was like, or not my first year, my second year, I guess.

Cause it was still COVID. Oh my God, TBT, I did this when I was an undergrad and then we were putting it on and I'll probably go again next year. It's like, it's always a cute time cause it's free and it's easy to get around. 

[01:14:44] : Yeah. 

[01:14:47] Diya Gaur: Did you learn anything like specifically from planning that event? Like maybe not so much on the geological side.

[01:14:54] Maoli Vizcaíno: No, just like, it is hard to rent things. Oh yeah, no, for sure, oh my goodness, yeah. I was like, oh, what do you mean, like, like, find, like, those poster board thing, like, to put up posters? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was like, what do you mean, I was like, how do you find this, like, we literally had, like, shop guys that we had, like, at Yale, who, like, had to make, they had to, like, make something for us.

Cause, like, we could not find online how to do it, yeah. And I did, I was in charge of the logo and the merch. 

[01:15:22] : Um, 

[01:15:23] Maoli Vizcaíno: and that was a whole thing too, like, even, like, printing one, like, little picture on a mug is a whole process. 

[01:15:29] Diya Gaur: Oh, yeah, no, for sure. 

[01:15:31] Maoli Vizcaíno: I was just like, wow, everything is harder than I ever thought it was gonna be, so that was mostly it.

I was like, okay, wow, like, maybe I won't sit there and criticize, like, GSA and AGU no more, cause this is crazy. And we had it. It was like, less than a hundred people go to this thing. It was like, It was like, like, like 80s, 90s something, because it was like, you know, just local schools. I was like, man, okay, okay, I see now.

But it was like, nice. It's kind of fun, like, all the different ways you can kind of be, like, behind the scenes and things, or like, being in charge of stuff, like, and it sucks because, you know, obviously, like, grad students do a lot of labor for their departments. It is, it is cool also, because it was like, we did all that for free, um, but 

[01:16:12] Diya Gaur: it was still cool.

Yeah, I can definitely relate to that. 

Final Thoughts and Future Plans

[01:16:16] Diya Gaur: Yeah, I mean, kind of going off topic here, but like, I run a non profit called Music Is Medicine, and we operate, like, across the United States, and we had a fundraising concert, like, a huge one last December, and we planned for about 1, 000 people. The logistics of that event were, like, so insane, and it was, like, crazy.

Insanely difficult to find a place to even host that and so I can't imagine like for places like AGU they have to rent that huge convention center. 

[01:16:44] Maoli Vizcaíno: So many people. 

[01:16:45] Diya Gaur: Yeah I don't know if they like print out everyone's research projects or posters but you know that is very tedious and time consuming job for sure so I applaud you.

Yeah 

[01:16:56] Maoli Vizcaíno: um but yeah no it's cool it's cool it's cool that you're going um I think it's nice that they like let high schoolers let high schoolers go I'm like I think that's important. Yeah. 

[01:17:05] Diya Gaur: For sure. They have a very specific program. It's like called the AGU Bright Stars Program. So if you want to promote that to your students as well, then yes.

Yeah, 

[01:17:13] Maoli Vizcaíno: for sure. Oh, those kids. Yeah, they're a little young. They're a little young. They're not. They're like, I need a more like sophomore, junior. 

[01:17:22] Diya Gaur: Oh, okay. Well, that's also a good time to start on 

[01:17:26] Maoli Vizcaíno: research. It's all still high school, that's for sure. 

[01:17:30] Diya Gaur: Yeah, it's never too early for research, I will say. I wish I started earlier, actually, like, with all these, like, different projects, because senior year is when the stress really 

[01:17:39] Maoli Vizcaíno: hits.

Yeah, that's real. Like, no, yeah, I mean, I don't know. I don't want to be like, oh, I'm sure it's, like, all fine. It's like, I don't know, I'm sure. College these days is like way different, and I'm like, not like, I don't know, wasn't that long ago that I was doing it, but still like, I think enough for it to be a pretty different landscape.

[01:17:56] Diya Gaur: Mm hmm, yeah, for sure. Do you have any more questions for 

[01:18:00] Maoli Vizcaíno: me? Um, no, I mean, I, I, I mean, I do, I, I mean, I do, I'll probably email you, honestly. Yeah, if you don't mind, I'm so, I'm so curious about your color search, and if you feel like you can, I mean, if you're like, if you're working with GeoForce people, I'm sure they're a lot of help, or like, you have college counselors and stuff, but if there's anyone specific you want to talk to, or have questions about, it's a pretty small world.

Um, I can, I can, I can probably find some information, or like, I don't know, if there's someone you want to talk to at AGU, or feel like you need. I like introductions or something. 

[01:18:34] Diya Gaur: That would be great. Thank you so much. Yeah. I mean, GeoForce, definitely very good program. If you're listening to this podcast, definitely check it out.

I would also recommend if you know any people in Texas, like, of course you do because you're from there, but you know, if they want to get involved in the earth sciences, definitely promote GeoForce. 

[01:18:51] : Yeah. 

[01:18:54] Diya Gaur: And if you want to end up going on like these trips for GeoForce, like you can always like go as a counselor, and you know, you could just get one to pay you for the trips, and you go for free, and so that's like already a really good part, and what you're doing is teaching high school kids, so it's a win win, really.

Yeah, 

[01:19:10] Maoli Vizcaíno: no, I mean, GeoForce was part of also why I was looking at UT, cause like here at Yale they have the Peabody, and I was like, That'll be a great place to like, work with folks and like, get experience. But also, like, at UTILS, like, oh, like, be so fun to like, you know, mentor high schoolers and stuff, um, there too, so, yeah.

[01:19:27] Diya Gaur: I mean, you don't even have to be, like, um, Person of UT to even help out. So yeah, just putting that out there. No, 

[01:19:35] Maoli Vizcaíno: that's, that is good to know. That is good to know. 

[01:19:38] Diya Gaur: Okay. Well, I don't think I have any more questions for you, but you know, thank you so much for your time. Like this was a really good, like, conversation.

And yeah, if any, if you do have any questions for me eventually, Please let me know. I'm always like happy to kind of help out. So yeah. Thank you so much for your time. I know we went over time, but thank 

[01:19:58] Maoli Vizcaíno: you. No, yeah, I had a great time. Thank you for reaching out. I know it took me a while to get back. Um, you know, my life is a mess.

But yeah, no, I had a nice time talking to you. I think, yeah, you're doing great. 

[01:20:08] Diya Gaur: Great. Thank you so much. Yeah, so good luck. I wish you good luck on the rest of your PhD career. I hope all goes well, and maybe I'll hopefully see you at a GU this year. 

[01:20:19] Maoli Vizcaíno: Yeah, yeah. I'll, I'll, I'll try and stop by y'all's, you know, y'all's thingy, um. I think that would be fun.