EP167 The New Book Is Out!

Ten years, 50,000+ copies, four languages, and about a million stories later… the second edition of Mastering Portrait Photography is here. Sarah flips the mic and grills me about why we did a new edition, what changed (spoiler: basically everything but one image), how mirrorless and AI have shifted the craft, and why a tiny chapter on staying creative might be the most important two pages I’ve ever written. There’s a Westie called Dodi, a cover star called Dory, and a street scene in La Boca that still makes me grin.

Enjoy!

Links:

Signed Copy of Mastering Portrait Photography, New Edition - https://masteringportraitphotography.com/resource/signed-copy-mastering-portrait-photography-new-edition/

 

Transcript:

Sarah: So welcome back to the Mastering Portrait Photography podcast and today's a special one. Hi, I'm Sarah, and I'm the business partner of Paul at Paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk and also his wife too. Now, you might already know him as the voice behind this podcast, but today I'm gonna get the rare pleasure of turning the microphone around and asking him the questions. So Paul, it's been 10 years since the first edition of mastering portrait photography hit the shelves, and with selling over 50,000 copies, multiple reprints and translation into four languages, it's safe to say it's had a bit of an impact, but as we all know, photography doesn't stand still and neither do you. So today we're diving into the brand new second edition. So Hello Paul.

Paul: Hello.

It feels weird saying hello to my wife in a way that makes it sound like we've only just met.

Sarah: Mm. Maybe, maybe.

Paul: The ships that pass in the night.

Sarah: Yes. So I thought we'd start with talking about the, the first version. You know, how did it come about? A bit of the origin story about it. Um, and I'll leave that with you.

Paul: Well, of course Confusingly, it's co-authored with another Sarah, um, another photographer. And the photographer and brilliant writer called Sarah Plater, and she approached us actually, it wasn't my instigation, it was Sarah's, and she had written another book with another photographer on the Foundations of Photography. Very popular book. But she wanted to progress and had been approached by the publisher to create Mastering Portrait Photography. This thing that we now have become used to didn't exist 10 years ago, and when she approached us, it was because she needed someone who could demonstrate photographic techniques that would live up to the title, mastering portrait photography. And we were lucky enough to be that photographer. And so that first book was really a, a sort of trial and error process of Sarah sitting and interviewing me over and over and over and over and over, and talking about the techniques that photographers use in portraiture.

Some of it very sort of over the sort of cursory look, some of it in depth, deep dives, but all of it focusing on how to get the very best out of your camera, your techniques, and the people in front of you. And that's how it came about. I mean, little did I know 10 years ago we'd be sitting here where we are with Mastering Portrait Photography as a brand in and of itself.This is the Mastering Portrait Photography Podcast

Yes,

because the book sold so well.

Sarah: And did you expect it to do as well as it

Paul : Oh, I'm a typical photographer, so, no, of course I didn't, you know, I kind of shrugged and thought it'd be all right. Um, and, and in some ways, because you have to boil it down into, I think there's a 176 pictures or there, there were in the first book or somewhere around there, a couple of hundred pages.

There's this sense that there's no way you can describe everything you do in that short amount of space. And so instead of, and I think this is true of all creatives, instead of looking what we achieve. We look at the things we haven't done. And I talk about this on the podcast regularly, the insecurity, you know, how to, how to think like a scientist.

That's something that will come up later when we talk about the new version of the book. But no, I, I thought it would be reasonably well accepted. I thought it was a beautiful book. I thought Sarah's words were brilliant. I thought she'd captured the, the processes that I was talking about in a way that clarified them because I'm not known for my clarity of thought.

You know, you know, I am who I am, I'm a creative, um, and actually what happened was the minute it was launched, the feedback we got has been amazing. And of course then it's gone on to be translated into Italian. A couple of different Italian versions for National Geographic. It's been translated into Korean, it's been translated into German, it's been translated into Chinese.

Um, and of course, technically it's been translated into American English. And, and one of the reviews that made me laugh, we've got amazing reviews on Amazon, but there is one that kind of made me laugh, but also upset me slightly, is that both Sarah and myself are British authors. Using English uk, UK English, but for the international market right from the get go the book was using American spellings,

Sarah: right?

Paul : We didn't know that was what was gonna happen. We provided everything in UK English and of course it went out in with American English as its base language. Its originating language. Um, and that's one of the biggest criticisms we

Sarah: got.

Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V4 (new AI): And when that's the criticism you're getting that people are a bit fed up that it's in American English and apologies to my US friends, of which I have many.

Um, it was the only one that really. I don't like that. So I thought, well, it must be all right. And so for 10 years it's been selling really well. book. I never knew it'd be in different languages. Um, it was in the original contract that if the publisher wanted to do that, they could.

And really, I only found out it was an Italian when I started getting messages in Italian from people who'd bought the book in Italy. And then of course, we found out. So it's been a remarkable journey and. I don't think I've been as proud of something we've done as I have of the book. I mean, me and you spent hours pouring over pictures and talking about stories.

Sarah had to then listen to me.

Sarah: Yes.

Paul: Mono, sort of giving these sort of diatribes on techniques and things we do. Um, you know, and I think, I think it's a remark. I, well, I still think it's a remarkable achievement. I'm really proud of it.

Sarah: Yes. Did, did you think the second edition would, would happen or, um, or how did it come about?

Paul: No, not really. Because if you remember, we did a sort of interim update, which was just off the ISBN, so the same ISBN, same book number, but we'd been asked if there was anything that needed tweaking minor word changes, those kinds of things.

And I assumed not really being, you know, that time experienced with this stuff is that was. Was a second edition, it was basically a reprint. So I sort of assumed that was the end of it. And then, um, we were contacted the end of last year, um, to say that with the success of the book over the past decade, would we consider, uh, refreshing it properly refreshing it, a new updated edition because of course there's lots of things that change over time.

Um. And it's, it was worth having another look at it. So no, I didn't expect it, but it was an absolute joy when the email came in

It must have been. It's, it's one of those things that's so lovely when other people appreciate it and know that, um, it would be really good to have a, have another go at it and, uh, see what's changed.

Sarah: So it kind of brings me onto what, what have you changed in it? What's, what are the new, the new bits that are in the second edition? Or was it even that from the first edition? You, you knew that there were things you'd love to include?

Paul: Well, in a decade, so much changes. I. The equipment is the most obvious. You know, there's a chapter at the beginning on Kit, so you know, one of these dilemmas with books. I think again, we took advice from the publisher as to what do you include in a book? And the publisher were really keen and have stayed really keen that there's a chapter on the kit at the beginning.

Um, and apparently that just helps a very particular part of the market sell. So that's fair enough. No problem with that. It's quite fun talking about technology. I don't mind it. Um, but of course that technology's evolved, so we had to update all of that to reflect the fact that 10 years ago we were just beginning to talk about the advent of mirrorless cameras, but they were nowhere near the quality of a digital SLR, for instance.

Well, now mirrorless is the professional choice. Everything has gone mirrorless because it's got fewer moving parts. The sensors have increased in, um, sensitivity to focusing, you know, there's a million reasons why that's happened. So of course we've updated all of the technology. I think more importantly, certainly from my point of view is in those 10 intervening years, I've changed every picture.

Our clients, the techniques, the. Post-production, the thought processes, um, even down to the fact that with mirrorless cameras, you can actually shoot in a slightly different way. I mean, I'm a traditionalist in many ways. I grew up with a film camera. Yes. So, you know, metering either using a meter or very careful control.

Because your dynamic range is pretty limited. Um, maybe the fact that you would focus on a point and then wait for whatever it is that's moving through it, to move through it and take your, take your picture. Um, these were the kind of techniques, you know, lock your focus repose when I started, even even A-D-S-L-R, you know, I'll give you a really good example on how the technology has helped, though.

It's not actually part of this book, but it's a, it's a really good illustrative point. Um, technology isn't the be all and end all of photography. What goes on in your head is what matters, but the technology is the enabler. And I work with the hearing dogs every week. We photograph running dogs all the time and with the DSLRs I was using, it would just take four goes, maybe five goes to get that perfect moment where the dog is spot perfect in focus.

It's airborne, its paws are off the floor. Everything about it is absolutely right. Four or five goes, you know, because I'm shooting at maybe 10 frames a second. The focusing is more or less keeping up because of course, every time you take a picture, the mirror slaps up and the focusing then has to predict where the dog might have ended up.

It's not doing, it's not tracking it at that point, and then you move to mirrorless. Um, and the Z9 that I use now, the Nikon is an unbelievable piece of kit. It locks onto the dog. I can shoot at 20 frames a second. Um, and one of those shots is invariably the shot I'm looking for. And, and that sounds like I'm cheating in some ways, but when you are a professional photographer, your job is to do the very best for your client.

And so instead of spending an inordinate, inordinate amount, it's not easy for me to say a very long time. Um. You know, trying to get the right shot. Now I can do it very quickly and move on to another shot so we can provide a wider variety to our clients. And that's true with running children too. Yes. So the technology has changed and the techniques have changed with it.

Um, now you're seeing on the back of your camera or through the viewfinder exactly the image. Not a facsimile of it, not a mirror. Prism view of it, you're seeing precisely what you're gonna capture. Um, and that gives you a huge amount of confidence in the shot and a huge amount of control too. You can really fine tune exactly how you want the exposure to be.

For instance, you know, you don't have to worry about, is that right? Let's must check the histogram afterwards. You can check the histogram, live in the viewfinder and all these little bits, just make your job different. They, you connect with the shot in a different way. You connect with a client in a different way, and that's the tech side.

But I've also, you know, I, in 10 years, I'm 10 years older. You know, in some ways I'm 10 years faster. In other ways, I'm 10 years slower. You know, the cameras are quicker, my shots are quicker, my knees are slower. Um, and it's a different perspective on life. I also teach a lot. The podcast, the book itself, the first edition of the book, led us to the podcast and the website where we run workshops and everything else.

So all of this cumulative knowledge, when you look back at the old book, and while I'm still massively proud of it, the new edition was a wonderful opportunity to sit down and say, what would I like, how would I like to be represented this time?

Yes,

and it's a much more grown up approach, I think. I mean, I, I wasn't a kid back then, but this time around because the book was successful, instead of providing 10 pictures for every slot, I provided the picture I want, in that slot.

Right?

And so the book is much closer to how I would like it to be as a photographer. Every picture. Now, I could tell you a story about every single picture, every single client, and having the luxury of success on the first version gave me the luxury of being able to do more of what I wanted in this version.

This is much more reflective, I think. Of me personally. Yes. And so I've, I've loved it. It's absolutely, it's such a, a lovely process to go through.

Sarah: So how many pictures have been changed between the two versions?

Paul: All bar one.

Sarah: bar one. How intriguing. So will you tell us what the one is, or is that

Paul: can, you can go and find that out for yourself.

Yeah, so there's one single image that hasn't been changed. There's single image that hasn't been

but every other image has has changed from the first edition.

Uh, just a caveat to that, of course, some of the kit pictures, uh, 'cause they were generic, they've stayed the same. But every portrait,

Wow.

every single portrait except for one, has been changed.

Sarah: And how did you go about choosing those pictures? 'cause I can imagine, you know, if you're starting effectively with a blank canvas for where the images have gotta go, uh, how on earth did you do that

Paul: Um, slowly the publisher will tell you, uh. The thing to you have to remember though, is that this is an updated edition.

Yes.

And that was the contract. It was not a complete start again. So, although I had the opportunity to change every picture, every picture had to fit into an almost identical space because they weren't gonna redesign it.

Right. It's updated edition and we have to be clear about that. So part of the puzzle was not just, which pictures do I want to illustrate, which point.

It was, which pictures in the same shape previous do I want to illustrate? I mean, there's some wiggle room in there, but the designers did not want to do a full redesign. That was not what we were contracted for. Um, obviously the words were being updated too. And both Sarah and myself, um, I mean, since the first book I now write for magazines and online articles and things all the time, I write for all sorts of photography stuff.

Um, and so actually both Sarah and myself wrote words this time round. Um, but nonetheless, we couldn't change too much. We could bring it up to date, but there, there were still bits that, you know, if I was being truly honest, there are things that I think in the past 10 years have become less relevant. And things, it would've been nice to have put some different stuff in, but that again, this is an updated edition, um, not a complete from the ground up rewrite.

So actually I sat down and I looked at all of the, um, chapters and the words that we'd written in the first edition and thought about what we were trying to illustrate and went back to sort of basics really, and where I already had pictures in the portfolio. Um, we used pictures of great clients, interesting light, interesting locations, interesting techniques where there are certain things where, I'm not sure, the first time round, um, the illustrations of them were as good as I, as strong as I would've liked.

I shot them again here in the studio, so things like the lighting pattern. You know, I have, I've talked about them for 10 years, these lighting patterns. So it was a really nice chance to sit Katie, who works for us in the studio, uh, to sit Katie in front of the camera and say, right, this is what we're gonna do.

And I worked every lighting pattern and redrew every diagram to make that absolutely on point, which I think the first time round, while they are very, very good. They're not what I would've liked them to be this time round. So there was that side of it too. And then of course, and I'm sure you're gonna come onto it, there's a couple of, well, there's a new chapter in there which did give us a chance to explore something a little bit different.

Um, so yeah, it was just a long process of finding pictures that if I'm gonna put my name to it, are the ones that I would like. Yes. And it's not always the best picture. It's not always the competition winners. they're in there. They are in there. Of course they're in there. Um, but I think this time round, um, I really enjoyed reminiscing.

I think some of the pictures in there, they're all beautiful pictures, don't get me wrong. But some of the people I picked to be in them are people because actually that was a moment that I will remember for the rest of my life for all sorts of reasons. And I think the, the strongest example of that is our cover shot is Dory now.

The story of Dory. That sounds really weird. The story of Dory? photo. Dory. Story of photograph. Oh yeah, my

you met Dory? Or should we go with

I dunno if the story of Dory that's like, sounds like a children's book. That'd be a great chance to write a children's book. So Sarah and I were having dinner. Dory was working in the restaurant that, uh, we are having dinner in.

Um, I laughed to Sarah and said, I think, um, Dory would photograph beautifully. Sarah said, we'll, go and ask her. And I asked her and she said, no. She absolutely said no, categorically. And I said, okay. Then I wrote our email address, sorry, I wrote our web address. Uh, on the back of a, of a napkin and handed it to her.

I said, look, you know, if you're not interested, that's fine, but have a look at my work. Um, and this was after the first edition of mastering portrait photography, and my idea was for Dorie to come to the studio and we'd film some stuff where we photographed her and use it for information, stuff for people who read the book and maybe create some YouTube videos and things.

Um, anyway, at four o'clock in the morning, got an email back from Dory saying, actually, I've just looked at your work. Yes, please. And Dory has gone on to be someone we've worked with fairly regularly. Um, mostly, um, because she's just the nicest person in the world, but also she's supremely photogenic and you bring those two things together and they're the kind of people I love to work with.

I love to celebrate. Photography with, so her picture, one of those pictures I shot in that session is the cover shot in the book and she features later on as well. 'cause she's come back with her husband and her kids and it's just a delight. And then there, you know, there are people from all over the world.

Um, and so there's a lot of memories in there for both me and for you I

Yes,

Um, and it was, uh, just a pleasure to go through it. Oh, and the other thing is every single shot is shot since we published the first edition. So I did limit us to the past 10

everything is limited to what, what you've captured in the last 10 years?

Yeah. Yes. Because

figured that, um, if you're gonna do an updated edition, then, although there were pictures in the first version of the book, I would've loved to have had in there that never made it. Why don't we start from that point and move forwards?

Other than the one

Other than

other than the one other than,

one

Sarah: so you've, you've talked a little bit about how you've changed and that's been reflected in the book. You've talked a little bit about how the technology has changed, but probably one of the biggest changes has been post-production, um, the introduction of, of ai. So is that reflected in the book,

Paul: Yeah, of course it is. Um, the post-production chapter, um, I mean, the thing with post-production is that's a volume of books in and of itself. Uh, we put it into the book Sarah and myself, because I think it was important to note that an image isn't generally finished in camera. It's finished when it's finished.

And this is true for film, by the way. This is not news, you know? Um, and it's for as long as film has been shot, transparency's and negatives. People have been doing a certain amount of post-production on them afterwards in their development tanks. Um, or whether they're doing hand toning or something is', this isn't new for me.

I think you're about halfway there. Now, the second half might be a very short half, but it's almost certainly gonna evolve, at the very least, um, brightening controlling your tones and cropping. Okay. Maybe a bit of sharpening if that's your thing. So we put that chapter in just to make the point that there is a finishing stage.

That was 10 years ago. In those 10 years, everything has changed. Yes.

Yes.

You know, even if I just kept it to the Photoshopping that we had in the first edition, all of that is different. I. And of course AI has now arrived. Um, I mean, it's a precocious child of a technology at the moment, but it's growing up really very fast and it's gonna affect us in every single element of us as creatives of, of us as business owners.

There's, there's no part of our work. Even. Even the people that say I don't believe in AI are using cameras that have AI in them. You know, there's no way of escaping it. It's here with us and you can fight it if you want. And there are bits of it that I'm not that comfortable with. Certainly some of the training, the way they did it on images, without any acknowledgement of copywriting things, it's problematic.

But in the end, it's here, it's now, and if you don't embrace it, the people who are in your market as a professional competing with you. Are embracing it so there's no getting around it. So yeah, there's a part of our post-production now talks about specifically EVOTO.AI, which is the app that we use.

There's others as well re Bloom and a few others that do a very similar thing. Um, and we've put it in there. Again, not as this is what AI does, but for make, to make people aware that AI is now part of the puzzle. Use it, don't use it. And that's completely your choice. The same as it is with Photoshop. But it's a good place to just remind people.

That this is the direction of travel for a good chunk of the industry. So yeah, we've changed that quite a lot.

Sarah: And a section at the end. Is it

Paul: my favorite section? Yes. this

Sarah: a, this was a request from you to add this in.

Paul: Yes, yes.

Um, there's a, one of the things with doing this as a job, and it's not just a risk, it really does happen, is you find yourself.

Sort of burnt out isn't the right word for it, really, or the right phrase for it. But you find yourself same old, same old, same old. You get good at stuff, you get known for stuff. People ask you to do that stuff. You do more of it. You, you're still good at it, but eventually you start to find yourself just a little bit flat.

Um, and it happens all the time. And so I put a chapter and I asked the publishers if we could wiggle some stuff around and make some space to put one specific chapter in. It's not a long chapter, but to me it might be the most important chapter in there. It's about staying creative. It's just little techniques, little ideas for staying on top of your game, thinking of new things, being a creative.

And, and being a creative is something you have to work at. You can't just, you don't just invent ideas. You have to be open to seeing things and thinking things and trying things, experimenting, working with different people, having mentoring. These are all the facets that I wanted to just in a very short chapter, 'cause we could only squeeze in a couple of pages.

But it's the chapter that I think I am the most proud of

Sarah: Yes. And knowing you as well as I do, you know, it's part of my challenge in the business is making sure that you keep motivated and keep being creative. So I, I know how important it's, and how we have to put shoots in the diary and, and do things that are just for you, for no other reason. Just than just to let you play. So I, I can see how important that is.

Paul: Yeah. I'm, I'm aware of just how much cotton wool you wrap me in and I can feel it building as well. I always know when I'm not firing on all cylinders, because you start to sort of wrap cotton wool around me and start to think about putting it in other things that we need to do, or just a break to get away for a week.

You know, there's those things. It's really hard. It's hard being a creative, as in it's hard to be a creative a hundred percent of the time, and b, creative a hundred percent of the time. The, the, you know, being called a creative is one thing, but actually being creative is a process of invention and experimenting and doing things that you haven't done before.

That's the point of being creative. Um, and so, yeah, I'm always aware when I'm clearly starting to feel a bit frazzled because I can feel you starting to. Talk about doing other things.

Sarah: So what I didn't realize is what you said earlier, that the, all the images have all been taken since the last book. Um, and they're from clients we've had all around the world as well.

So I wondered if it would be. Nice to pull out a couple of our favorite images. Um, I sort of going on from your comments about staying creative. One that jumps out to me is when, um, Vivian and Dody came to the studio and, you know, this was a, a lady who came in with her West Highland tert. So Westy Westy, it's a

white west. Highland, ter.

And, um, we did some beautiful shots indoors, outdoors, um, having lots of fun. And then you built this, uh, amazing scene, um, which is including in the, included in the posing chapter. Do you wanna just explain and tell me a little bit about that one? Yeah. Um.

Paul: Um, you know, Dodie, sorry.

Vivian had emailed Dodie didn't email, obviously Doty's

Do's dog,

Vivian Vivian emailed to say she wanted a shoot with her dog. And I kind of, I say I distinctly remember the email. I remember what she said in the email, which is that she couldn't find another photographer who photographed the owner with their dog.

Now, I dunno how hard Vivian looked. I'm not, I'm sure there's a lot of photographers listening to this that photograph dogs with their owners and I judge a lot now as a, as a judge and as a coach. So I know it to. Out there. But anyway, she landed on us and I'm thrilled that she did Vivian and, uh, Dodie turned at the studio.

And Vivian is just beautiful. She's elegant. She has a real sort of gentle way about her, uh, and this beautiful little West Highland ter, which was for the first 10 minutes, I have to be honest in now. Backstory, my Nan had repeatedly West Highland Terriers. My Nan repeatedly did not train her. Westie, my Nan's dogs repeatedly bit us all of us as kids, as teenagers, as adults.

Even my dad would like shut the door and run because this dog would go for him. And so when she turned up with this little Westie, I must admit I backed away. However, Dodi, just like Vivian, was gentle and calm and just followed her around and, and he would sit. In the studio just looking at her while we worked, if it was shots for her on her own.

And then when she scooped him up or we tried to do something with him, he was so patient and so well behaved. So I've got this incredible client who wants to do these shots, and at the end of the shoot sometimes the greatest privilege you get is to say to someone, how long have you got? And if they've got a little bit more time.

What you can do is say, would you mind just trying a few bits with us? So we cleaned the studio out. It's a white, the, the dog was a white dog. Vivian had a light colored outfit and this kind of fair, and she was just, it. It struck me that we could do something interesting with the white walls of the studio, the white floor of the studio, the white posing blocks that I've had probably for 20 years here.

And so I did a couple of things and we, we shot some different combinations and then in the post-production STA stage, I built a model of our studio in 3D in blender, it with blocks exactly the same. And then I can create almost any scene I wanted around this shot that's right in the middle of Dodi looking up at Vivian.

Um, and it was one of those shoots that, I mean, every shoot in here, there's a story similar to this where I could tell you it's a shoot I'll remember forever. Um, and it was, and it was just a, a real luxury and, and just, you know, I dunno if Vivian listens to the podcast, but hello. Um, and Vivian's also very kindly sourced books from China for us.

Yeah.

yes. It's

hard to get hold of some of these things when you are not in country. So we're still in touch with her very much. He's a lovely client.

Another one that, um, oh, actually there's quite a few in the book from where we work as master photographers with Crystal cruises and so, um.

Sarah: We've got this lovely line where we talk about the book, where is it From Venice to Vietnam and Haddenham to Hawaii. Yeah. But, uh, one of my favorite shoots that's included is Christine, when we were in Brena Aires, and actually this is from this year when we were in South America and there's quite a few people that we borrowed on the ship to get some pictures. And also what a lovely opportunity.

I think it's in locations. Um. Where there is it and where was it? It was in Le Bocca. Wasn't Itca Le Bocca with Christine? Do you

Well, a little bit about that one? What's

Paul: It has been a, a real luxury for us in the intervening 10 years. So a lot happened in 20 14, 20 15. And one of the things that happened around the time of the book was they were asked to work with Crystal Cruises, a company that provided the photography to them.

Interviewed myself and Sarah. Sorry, us too.

It's

weird talking, made a third person and giving it right here. Um, interviewed us as a team and ever since then we've been traveling the world with them grading high-end portraits for these beautiful international clients. Um, and this time round the deadline.

Not the instigation, but the deadline for the book came up while we were working for about seven weeks around South America on the cruise. So I already had earmarked images from previous cruises, previous visits to different places. But when I was on the ship, there were a couple of people, um, that really leapt out just.

Ship. And one of the great luxuries when you have something like a book or you like you've become well known as a photographer, is you can say to people, would you mind stepping in to allow us to take some photographs? So there's a couple of people from the crew where you have to get permission to work with the crew.

Um, there's, um. Uh, Barbara is one of the team on there. Uh, say Hi is one of the people on there, um, who were crew members that we just loved the way they were with us. They made our lives wonderful. And so we photographed them specifically to put them in the book. Um, and then there's a client of ours, which is the one you've alluded to, which is Christine Now.

We met Christine at the end of another shoot, and this is. Um, I mean, remember this is still the Mastering Portrait Photography podcast, and so it's always worth remembering some of the things that you can do as photographers. This is not just an interview about me in a book, but here's some ideas for you that work.

So on the ship, we had just done a shoot, an amazing shoot, and a lady who was in that shoot was showing her images round the bar to all of her friends on our iPad. Now we were drinking, we were sat and we were sat next to this lovely lady who was very quiet and we'd said hello and had a quick chitchat, but not majorly a long conversation.

When our client handed us back the iPad, Christine, who was the lady who was sitting with us, said, do you mind if I have a look? And I said, yeah, of course. It'd be my pleasure. You know? So she had a look and she said, would you be willing to do that for me? And I said, well, of course we would, you know, this is what we're here for.

Um, and so we arranged to do a couple of different bits. A couple of it is actually two different shoots, but we did a site visit to Le Baca, this area in Buenos Aires. Is that right? Yes. Bueno Aires. Was it? No. Yes. Yes, it was. Bueno

Argentina. Yeah. Thank you. Are

confused. So we, we did a couple of visits to this place in, uh, bueno Aires Laca to go and check it out for different locations.

Uh, myself and you and Keith, who's our client, strictly speaking, who runs the, the photo. Um, company found all these locations and went the following day with Christine to go and explore this really beautiful, touristy area of leer. It's very characterful, it's very hot. Um, very intense actually. There's a lot going on and you do have to have your head on a swivel.

Yes.

it's quite notorious for pickpockets and thefts and so you do have to be careful. So, Sarah, I mean you, sorry, this is really weird. So

I'm

used those to talking on my own. So you and me, we were working as a team with Keith. Christine was not. Christine was stealing sausages from barbecue places and running them down alleyways that probably she shouldn't have been.

Christine

everywhere, but really where we wanted her to be, which was safe and in our site. Um, and if you remember, we kind of, um, we went round a corner. In fact, we were just heading back to the car. We, so Christina had arranged the driver and we'd gone round the corner, haven't we? And we were in this little street.

And I just, I looked over the top of the cars to the street shops, the shop fronts on the other side of the road and thought that would make a great picture because the color of Christine's dress, the color of these shops, the whole scene would just be something interesting. But I'm shooting across the road through cars.

Um, we've got Keith on the other side of the road with her. You are on the side of the road with me. Both of us trying to keep eyes everywhere 'cause we've now stepped out of the touristy bit. We are now in an area where, strictly speaking, you shouldn't be hanging around with a 10,000 pound camera.

Yes.

Um, so I dragged the shutter.

I got, I got everything else. I wanted it and dragged the shutter in a gap between the cars as somebody walked past. And I have this shot of Christine killing herself, laughing, looking at the camera. Um. With somebody walking past and it has this real vibe of a street shot, a candid shot. It's not, it's been staged, but it's one of my favorite shots in the book because it's, to me, every time I look at it, and this is true of your clients too, and when you're listening, the photographers are listening to this.

Remember this every picture, if you've created an experience around it, that picture. We'll hold memories for that client of yours. And it's true for me too. This experience was amazing. We're still in touch with Christine. She's desperate for us to go out and visit her in Texas. Um, but it was such a privilege, such a pleasure.

So much laughter and that every time I open that page in the book, that's what it takes me

it. I

I'm with

I love the colors, I love everything about it. And it's nice that it's such a lovely story too.

crazy story.

Sarah: So who do you think the book is for? Who do you think we'd pick it up and find useful?

Paul: Well, I'm hoping another 50,000 people will be. I've, I don't, I don't have total control over that. Um. It's really this, I think there's something for almost any portrait interested photographer in there. Um, if you are already a pro, you're probably not gonna pay a lot of attention to the kit chapter at the beginning. That won't be your shtick. Um, but there will be stuff on posing and interactions and some of the post-production might be of interest.

Um, if you are ready. You know, a supremely experienced photographer, you might like it simply 'cause the pictures are really beautiful. I still buy photo books because I will pick them up, look at the pictures and think, do you know what? I'm gonna use that idea. I'm gonna meld that into something else I'm doing because I like, I love seeing.

Great photographs. If you are truly a beginner, there's enough in there to get you going. And some of the techniques are a little bit further out there, but mostly it builds on this idea that you have a camera, you have a client, you have your subject, and you're gonna create an experience. And then from that experience, great pictures.

So I think it's broader than possibly the mastering portrait photography title gives it. Um, but it covers a little bit of all bases. And it certainly has enough in there to say, actually there's, there's stuff in there that if you do this, it really is quite, um, sophisticated.

Yes. Do you, we don't know at this stage in terms of whether it'll be translated into other languages that that usually comes a year after, doesn't it? After the, you

last time, say. It was only when I started getting emails in Italian.

Yes. Um,

that I noticed what happened. And we didn't know if you remember that it was in Chinese and Korean

no.

we started to put the marketing together for this book.

Yes. And we asked the publisher AB, in absolute terms, how many copies have you sold?

Yes. And they

back with different language versions that we never knew about. Yeah. So, you know. Been

been a, a journey of discovery,

a journey.

a journey.

Yes. So, yeah, who

knows? I, I really hope they do, uh, create some, uh, different language versions of it.

'cause there's nothing quite like seeing your work in Italian,

Yes. So, And, and Chinese, I think that's the one I find the, the most intriguing.

Sarah: So the book is officially launched next Tuesday, I believe.

Is the 28th. The 28th. Um, so what, what's on the horizon next is what, what are you gonna be doing with the book and

knows? Um, I mean, obviously the first thing we've gotta do is get through the launch of the book.

Yes.

Um, which is exciting. And obviously us two have been walking the studio trying to figure out how to tidy the whole place up. 'cause we haven't done a full on party probably since the last book. No. Or thereabouts.

So we've we're inviting. Everybody who's featured in the book Yeah. Um, to a, a launch at the weekend. Yeah. Um, and we are refreshing all of the pictures in the studio, uh, to reflect the pictures that are in the book as well. And it's just, it'll be such a lovely thing to do and it's, I can't wait to see everything when it's up.

Yeah. So that's, but next week's gonna be a bit fraught

It's 'cause in the middle of all that, I think I've got five shoots to work my way through.

Right. I don't sleep much. I

a challenge.

Yeah. I'm not, I'm

I'm not being super,

thankfully. Um, so there's that. And then, you know, once that gets rolling, of course I go back to our regular job. I'm judging for the British Institute. Professional photographers print competition straight after. So we've got.

A big bash on the Saturday night. Yeah. Uh, for all of our, all the people in the book on the Sunday, we're inviting anybody's around to come and a studio

open day, studio

open day in the afternoon. And then at some point in that afternoon, I have to go all the way up to Preston Salubrious, uh, Preston, to go and begin the process of judging the print competition for the 2025 print masters.

So a lot going on.

And you're gonna be busy signing books as well.

yeah,

It's been a

while since I've had to sit and do a big a book signing, but there's a load of that going on. Yeah. Uh, it's just lovely.

exciting. It really is. Well, I think that just about brings us to the end of everything. So I've enjoyed being on the other side of everything.

Sarah: So I'd just like to say, Paul, thank you ever so much for letting me do that and sitting on the other side of the mic today, um. We have got a limited number of copies here at the studio that Paul can sign, but they will be available at all. Good bookshops, um, with water zones. I think there's some competitions going where they will be with Graphistudio and with.

Um. A professional photo. Yeah.

Yep.

So there's, there's lots of ways for you to get your hands on it and uh, we'd love to know what you think of it and um, especially if you've got the first version and seeing the second version, we'd love some feedback 'cause we are so proud of it. And especially with the pictures in there, and if you can tell us what's that, what's the picture in there that, that haven't been changed? That will be even better.

There's no prize.

So, no, thank you. Thank you very much. Well,

it's a pleasure. And you know what you've gotta say now, don't you? What's

that? If you've enjoyed this podcast, is it? No.

If you've enjoyed this podcast, please head over to mastering portrait photography.com, which is full of articles.

And as it happens, I'm doing all of the behind the scenes diagrams and stories for the images that are in this book. It'll probably take me 10 years to get there, but there's a couple of hundred of those. Uh, and of course, whatever else you do.

be kind to yourself.

Take care guys.