In this episode of The Last Service Podcast, host Matt McGee sits down with songwriter, producer, and author Andrew Osenga to explore what decades of touring, worship leading, and church observation have taught him about the American church’s changing landscape.
Osenga reflects on thirty years of visiting more than a thousand congregations—from small rural Bible churches to sprawling suburban campuses—and what he’s learned about conflict, consumerism, and community. Together, he and Matt unpack how the...
In this episode of The Last Service Podcast, host Matt McGee sits down with songwriter, producer, and author Andrew Osenga to explore what decades of touring, worship leading, and church observation have taught him about the American church’s changing landscape.
Osenga reflects on thirty years of visiting more than a thousand congregations—from small rural Bible churches to sprawling suburban campuses—and what he’s learned about conflict, consumerism, and community. Together, he and Matt unpack how the forces shaping our sanctuaries mirror the forces shaping our cities.
Key Takeaways
1. Conflict is necessary for health.
Osenga reminds us that “conflict breeds intimacy.” Churches that avoid hard conversations often erode from within. Working through disagreement builds trust, while evading it leaves only the weary to close the doors. Healthy transitions require the courage to face tension with grace.
2. The Amazonification of churches is hollowing out communities.
Like small-town main streets replaced by big-box stores, small and mid-sized churches are vanishing. The result: decaying sanctuaries and fewer places where people can be known and contribute meaningfully. Consumer-driven growth models have built impressive megachurches but failed to reach more people for Christ—fewer Americans attend worship now than 25 years ago. This is a challenge for denominations, networks, and even local governments to confront together.
3. We lack the vocabulary to talk about endings.
Consumerism has narrowed the church’s language to victory and positivity, leaving little room for lament, loss, or transition. We have business terms for growth but few pastoral words for shepherding an ending. Recovering that vocabulary is essential if the Church is to model resurrection hope in seasons of closure and change.
Why It Matters
This conversation invites pastors, denominational leaders, and everyday church members to see endings not as failures, but as sacred transitions. If your congregation is wrestling with decline, conflict, or questions of sustainability, Osenga’s reflections offer language—and hope—for walking that road faithfully.
Resources:
"The Amazonification of the Local Church" on Andrew Osenga's Substack
http://www.andrewosenga.com/
Order Andrew Osenga's new book: How to Remember: Forgotten Pathways to an Authentic Faith
"Expectations" by Andrew Osenga
The Pivot with Andrew Osenga
Hutchmoot
Sticky Faith, Fuller Youth Institute
Ryan Burge / Graphs About Religion
AWANA Clubs
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