In this episode Dennis is joined by his long time friend David Fulton in one of their regular phone conversations. In this discussion David refers to his experience of being excused from an institutional church because he dared to asked the question "Why do you believe what you believe?". It brought out the fact that this group of believers had no desire to explore more about their faith. Dennis and David agree that to know Jesus more intimately you need to be "thirsty".
The book David refers to is NT Wright, Paul, A Biography, Harper One, 2018.
The reference to "Chapter 2" is an article by Dennis entitled "Paradigm Shift".