It's great to have Clive Washbourn back on the show. The Episode I recorded with him two years ago has been the most downloaded of any so far, so it’s obviously going to be good for business to do a follow-up.
But it’s more than that. Clive is one of those people who is famous in the market. He is someone who people tell stories about, so you’ve heard about him even if you haven’t met him.
So when he founded his Navium MGA it was a no-brainer to ask him on the show. I had no idea what to expect. What happened was Clive being an absolute force of nature and one of the most revealing and fun interviews I have ever been a party to.
We did that one under a lockdown over a video call. This time we are face-to-face in Navium’s office on Lime Street in the heart of the London market.
It makes a huge difference to be physically in the room with someone like Clive. He really comes alive.
What follows is another tour de force which reveals what is driving this remarkable marine MGA and what has pushed it to produce an amazing $360mn in gross written premium.
We talk about the market, Clive’s business philosophy and where Navium is heading and how it fits in with Pine Walk and the wider, and now restructured, Fidelis operation.
But because this is Clive, we get into something that we rarely talk about elsewhere:
Listening back, we grapple with the true art of underwriting and how to play yourself into a strong market position. We learn how you can be a really technical underwriter without being the least bit boring and how you need to be ultra-selective and teach yourself to maximise opportunities whenever they arise.
We also get an idea of how you can turn down large amounts of under-priced business but at the same time make the brokers keep coming back to see you.
After two interviews I’ve got my own theory. I think people come to see Clive because they really enjoy his company.
I think he is someone you could talk to about anything and he would make it an interesting conversation and an honest an unflinching exchange of views. I get the feeling Clive makes all the people he talks to feel understood and special.
Here Clive even reveals a historical interest in the battle of Waterloo and burnishes his prog rock credentials by bursting straight into song!
We both had a lot of fun – and I learned a huge amount - and so will you.
NOTES
Abbreviations:
TLO is a Hull insurance abbreviation for Total Loss Only.
ULR is the Ultimate (Net) Loss ratio.
Rinku Patel is mentioned as being in the room with us. He is CEO of Navium’s incubator Pine Walk and is also now COO of Fidelis MGU as well as being its UK CEO.
The quote ‘No battle plan survives the first shots of war/first contact with the enemy’ has been attributed to many, including Napoleon, but probably dates back to an 1871 paper by Prussian Field Marshal, Helmuth von Moltke.
And finally, here’s a link to the 1973 progressive rock classic Karn Evil 9 by Emerson, Lake & Palmer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLS0Med0s6E the original had to be split into 3 parts so that it could fit on a vinyl LP! Clive’s part comes in at 8’40”…
LINKS
We thank our naming sponsor AdvantageGo:
https://www.advantagego.com/
Ep 94 William Spiegel Executive Chairman R&Q: Prospering as the insurance ecosystem comes apart
Ep 93 Simon Matson of Gallagher and Tom Wakefield of Gallagher Re: A deal made by customers
Ep 92 Andreas Berger Swiss Re Corporate Solutions: Start early and do it quickly
Ep 91 Bob Kimmel CEO of K2 Insurance Services: On the hunt for talent and capacity
Special Episode: What the Polish market wants, with Michał Chmielewski and Tomasz Libront of Smartt Re
Ep 90 Javier San Basilio of Mapfre Re: Not opportunistic by definition
Ep 89 Jeff Radke CEO Accelerant Holdings: Searching for gems & avoiding landmines
Ep 88 Monica Cramer Manhem, President, International Reinsurance SiriusPoint: Using all the tools in the box
Special Episode: The Future of Underwriting with James Slaughter and Silvi Wompa Sinclair
Ep 87 Rod Fox & Rob Bredahl of TigerRisk: Don’t stop me now
Ep 86 Philip Smaje and Marcel Chad of Piiq Risk Partners: Specialty risks need specialty brokers
EP 85 Clive Washbourn CEO Navium: The market is always good
Ep 84 Keith Harrison International CEO Lockton Re: Going head to head with the bigger brokers
Special Episode: State of the Market Roundtable with Greg Hendrick, Marc Adee and Andrew Robinson
Ep 83 The $60bn broker: Olga Collins CEO Worldwide Broker Network (WBN)
Special Episode: The Power of Purpose with Steve Hearn CEO of Corant Global and Delta V Partners
Ep 82 David Bearman CEO Aventum: Don’t walk into a crowded room
Ep 81 Ash Bathia CEO Probitas 1492: Driving your own destiny
Ep 80 Matthew Shaw CUO of TMK: The most submissions for a decade
Ep 79 Neil Eckert and Trevor Carvey of Conduit Re: Big enough to be impactful but small enough to be nimble
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