This is part two of the conversation with Ivan Pupulidy. This time we talk about Ivan's work with understanding operational failures. Todd and Ivan talk like old friends - because they are old teaching buddies. In this conversation Ivan Pupulidy, Director of the Office of Learning at the US Forest Service, talks about the new view, learning, and the journey we are all taking to see the world in a new light. Ivan's has an extensive background in Aviation Safety, Fire Fighting, Operational Safety, and Accident Investigation and Learning.