Interview with Cassie Carlisle: Emmy Award-winning reporter at KGTV in San Diego
Interview with Cassie Carlisle: Emmy Award-winning reporter at KGTV in San Diego.
This podcast series is hosted by Patricia Kathleen and Wilde Agency Media. The series interviews women (& women-identified & non-binary) entrepreneurs, founders, and gurus across all industries to investigate those voices in business today. Both the platform and discussion are designed to further the global conversation in regards to the changing climate in entrepreneurial and founding roles.
TRANSCRIPTION
*Please note, this is an automated transcription please excuse any typos or errors
[00:00:07] Hi, my name is Patricia Kathleen, and this podcast series will contain interviews I conduct with female and female identified entrepreneurs, founders, co-founders, business owners and industry gurus. These podcasts speak with women and women, identified individuals across all industries in order to shed light for those just getting into the entrepreneurial game, as well as those deeply embedded within it. Histories, current companies and lessons learned are explored in the conversations I have with these insightful and talented powerhouses. The series is designed to investigate a female and female identified perspective in what has largely been a male dominated industry in the USA to date. I look forward to contributing to the national dialog about the long overdue change of women in American business arenas and in particular, entrepreneurial roles. You can contact me via my media company Web site. Wild Ducks agency. That's w i. L. D e. Dot Agency or my personal Web site. Patricia. Kathleen. Dot com. Thanks for listening. Now let's start the conversation.
[00:01:29] Hi, everyone, and welcome back. This is your host, Patricia. And today I am sitting down with Cassie Carlisle.
[00:01:35] Is an award winning reporter at KGTV in San Diego. Welcome, Cassie.
[00:01:42] Hi. Thank you so much for having me.
[00:01:44] Absolutely, I am excited to have you on, Cassie. You are one of the first members of the press that we have spoken to and a lot of people in our audience reach out and really want to unpack what we're doing. What you've done with your your story. And I'm just kind of what roles in the media look like for everyone listening. I'm going to give you a bio on Cassie. But before that, a quick roadmap of today's podcast. We are going to it's going to follow the same trajectory as all of these interviews with founders and entrepreneurs and people in business across all industries that we're doing with Patricia Kathleen Podcast's. We're going to talk about Cassie's academic background and early professional life, and then we'll turn straight towards where her work with KGTV and we'll go through the logistics of that, as well as some of the particulars as they pretend to Cassie and her career in particular. Then we're going to turn our attention towards goals that Cassie has for the next few years regarding her career and other endeavors that she is involved with. We will wrap everything up with advice that Cassie may have for some of those of you looking to emulate what she's done or get involved with her today. So a quick bio on Cassie. As a journalist, Cassie has covered stories that range from major crime scenes and snowstorms to hanging out with the Globetrotters while working at Scripps affiliate W. M a r. She created the segment made in Maryland highlighting unsung trades. Cassie has also worked in Bakersfield as an anchor and life desk reporter at Katie R o. Cassie got her hands on almost every job, trying out whether casting sports, anchoring, producing and editing. She won an Emmy with the 11:00 a.m. team leading the coverage in the Highway 58 mudslide outside of work. Cassie loves most outside activities hiking, boating and maybe soon surfing. She was a gymnast as a child, winning a bronze medal in the California State Games. Cassie feels fulfilled being a journalist, hoping to help people through providing information. Her favorite quote is by Ralph Waldo Emerson. Nothing great was ever achieved without enthusiasm. I love that Cassie. And I'm so excited to kind of unpack some of that. You've really gotten like you're a teenager. You've done like a smorgasbord across a ton of media. And while I do want to get into your media and like did the really deep trenches of that experience, you've had your first drops into your academic background and early professional life following the.
[00:04:12] Absolutely. So while I went to the Walter Cronkite School of Journalism at Arizona State, I do have to say I have to think Michaela Pereira, who was a producer and anchor at KTLA back when I was in eighth grade. She's the reason why I'm a reporter today, because she took the time to take my phone call when I was a little kid and tell me everything about this industry.
[00:04:35] So it's from that moment on that I've been pursuing this career and putting a camera in my hands and editing and trying out everything, if that's what you have to do as we evolve as an industry. Media has changed a lot in the last 20 years.
[00:04:51] Yeah. Was, you know, just funny. Just really quickly. I did the Walter Cronkite School. Yes. You just recently launched on PBS.
[00:04:58] West Coast Edition with that, like, they have a lot of really prominent things still coming out of that particular branch at LSU. Was it like that when you were obtaining your degree there?
[00:05:10] Yes, we were so lucky. It was incredible when I toured the school with my father and he asked the dean at the time, we found out that my freshman year I could get my hands on the camera. So growing up in that school, my junior and senior year, I was fortunate enough to be a part of the Walter Cronkite School's Cronkite News Watch program. So we were turning stories every day, just like a normal reporter, like we do like I do now. So it was absolutely incredible to have professors guiding us and helping us tell real stories, because the coolest part of being a student there is seeing your story picked up by one of the stations in the market as a student.
[00:05:53] So that was unreal.
[00:05:55] Yeah. Getting that workflow out into the market as you're still kind of learning about the industry, I think is what makes news and writing so cool for the potential, you know, a potentiality for students if they're driven enough. I think it's also kind of daunting for people who are still in the curriculum, but that is really cool. Did you know as you were obtaining the degree, were you always confirmed that you were going to go into media? Were you convinced that it was always going to be news or did you think about other outlets?
[00:06:23] I always wanted to do news because I grew up watching news in the morning. I always want to know what was going on. And I know that everybody's kind of changed the way that they obtain news these days. And sometimes still more difficult with social media. But I've always wanted to be the first person at the scene, find out the most information and and really be able to help people understand. I mean, when there's a fire, we're able to tell people, hey, you're home safe. Hey, you guys are going to start working with an insurance agency, you know? And those are critical moments as things are developing where we can provide information. So I have always been driven to be in news, not public relations or advertising or marketing or anything like that as well as neat as those companies are.
[00:07:07] Right. What did you some direction like as you were wrapping up your degree and leaving? Where did you go to you first? Do you go to the first job you could get? How did you, like, kind of develop your path?
[00:07:19] I actually got really lucky. I interviewed in Helena, Montana, for Helena. Yes. In Montana. And they were a teeny, teeny, tiny town. And it was snowing when I was there. I was like, oh, dear. I don't know if I could live in snow. And then I got a job offer over in Bakersfield, which was just an hour away from my hometown. And so I left at that opportunity. They had a pathway through the Cronkite school. So it was amazing to go straight from school to Scripps. And then everywhere else I've jumped to has been through the Scripps Company. So it's been a very easy path for me when it comes to being able to move around and experience different locations, because that was part of the reason I wanted to be a journalist, was to explore and have adventures, right?
[00:08:05] Absolutely.
[00:08:05] Now, did you set out knowing that you wanted to kind of sample or pepper into your your Rolodex, if you will, your skills, Rolodex, all these different areas, or did you do that because you weren't finding your niche?
[00:08:20] Oh, I knew that the more things I could do, the more valuable I'd be. Right. Oh, I want to make sure I was the most valuable piece of putty that they can put into any mold. So when I was at Chiaro, I had so much fun figuring out jumping in wherever they needed me, because in a small market, I mean, you really have about five people on a weekend show working double. It's really easy to plug in if somebody had to call out or have to go somewhere and just try out different jobs and really see kind of what called your name. And for me, it was still always recording. So I was just fortunate enough to be able to try being a sports anchor or try being a weathercaster and then get job offers in different realms. But I always want to stay true to reporting because that's just what things to me.
[00:09:06] Yeah. When did you when you landed KGTV?
[00:09:11] I just came here, goodness, about a year and a half ago. So it was me. I started my first day a little over a year ago. So it's been amazing. I serve now. Not well, but absolutely it feels very different from Baltimore.
[00:09:26] And I think that's the amazing thing is I've gotten to go to or have had the opportunity, rather, to go to these different towns and these different locations. I never would be otherwise in my life and really get on the ground floor and understand what builds communities and what makes them run. And it's just incredibly beautiful.
[00:09:48] Yeah, you've done it a lot of different outfits with different, like you say, varying different sizes of the shows that you were working with and things of that nature.
[00:09:55] I'm curious, do you find a continuity across a lot of the different projects and people that you've worked with as far as the ethos goes of the company in the news, or does it change from state to state, from city to city? Do some of the greater goals or the lenses that are applied to the news change? Can you speak to that through a through all of the different ones you've worked for?
[00:10:17] Absolutely. So I feel like the lens kind of changed on a national scale. So when I was in Baltimore, I read a little more threatened as a reporter. I had eggs thrown at me right before I did a live shot when I was standing in front of the police headquarters here. I'd gotten accosted by people who don't believe that I'm an unbiased reporter. And the thing that I have to say about that is I just wish that everyone gives others an opportunity to share what they're doing because it's not one sided. So many people come at the news and say, you hate or love Trump, you hate or love these policies. And this is politics where when you're a local reporter, your focus is the story, getting the facts and sharing that with others. And I know that that sounds extremely idealistic, but that's what I strive to do and what I believe I do every single day. So when someone can give me the opportunity to tell them, here's both sides. I'm just putting it out there. It really helps me because, I mean, again, I went to the Walter Cronkite gold journalism. We were instilled with just the facts, ma'am, and that's what I try to do.
[00:11:31] So you get in, you know, in your bio and some of it talks about, you know, mudslides and you mentioned, you know, whether or not this house is safe or whether or not they're calling the insurance company and the store is really meaning a lot to you.
[00:11:43] Have you cultivated a certain type of reporting or a story that you find is kind of your niche, that you very specifically are driven towards reporting or the human interest stories? What area do you find yourself more drawn to the further you get into your career?
[00:12:01] I really love stories that help people, and I know that that sounds kind of silly, but these days there's a lot of people who are struggling and they don't have the information or the connections to get what they need done done so. Perfect example was in Bakersfield, there was a 12 year old boy named Alex who had cancer since he was four. And we did a story on him. I was doing it all by myself. And because that's what happens when you're in a small market. And I went out Menaged family and he had no teeth because of all of the cancer treatment. It had made them fall out. So just by sharing his story, he actually had this incredible singing voice. And I really, you know, showed that in the beginning. At the end of the story, it was very poignant. So many people fell for him and felt for his family and just started doing this as one go on. He was brand new and he got cards from around the world because his story got picked up by so many people. And that is that is why I'm here, is to help somebody who doesn't have a voice.
[00:13:11] Yeah, absolutely. So do you even speaking back to, you know, having things thrown at you and saying that news changed on the national level and it feels like you were kind of tying in the tone of know recent politics and things of that nature.
[00:13:25] But I do know that the press, you know, there has been kind of a a voice about regarding a lot of the mainstream press feeling very unsafe. And for female reporters such as yourself or those who identify as female or non binary. I think the stakes are even a little bit higher because it was always, you know, an area where I really wasn't feeling safe. But do you feel like there's a tide or a tenant of change that could be happening? Or how is how are women reporters or women looking to go into news and reporting supposed to be addressing this kind of rising climate of of danger? You know, that seems to be encouraged sometimes, at least was in the last presidential campaign by the candidates. Right. And you feel like there's a climate there's a way that we can react as change. Or do you and your colleagues, as women reporters, you guys speak about how to react to that?
[00:14:22] Absolutely. I think it's about being smart. And I know that that sounds really straightforward and kind of silly, but you need to look at where you're going. If that neighborhood is a bad neighborhood, if you're going with somebody, because often we do because we have enough wonderful people in position to know you shouldn't go to certain areas by yourself. But you are your own advocate, right, in that sense. So it's so important for you to get your mind around the story and then around your safety. So it's all about changing your mindset as well. It's not just the job, it's also your safety. I actually just saw on Facebook, I don't know if you've seen this video. It's very upsetting where a woman is an MSJ reporter, which means multimedia journalist. So she's shooting her own stuff, doing interviews and editing herself. That's kind of what I do here in there. And she was hit over the head by a homeless person while she was carrying her tripod and turned away. So in those moments, we just have to be very much like police officers or anyone else is a first responder where you're headed on a swivel no matter where you're at. And I've been in a couple situations where I've been in NJ reporting by myself, and I've called my boss and said where I am and just kept them on the phone until I got to my car. They're extremely understanding, extremely supportive because they don't want anything to happen to you either. So I hope that that answers your question.
[00:15:48] Yeah, it does. And I think they're just opening the dialog. You and I talked off the record when I first pitched you to come on the series and speak with us about it.
[00:15:56] We had a little bit of a conversation regarding, you know, the danger of of women employees across all industries and anyone who's going into the field. And just this there was a concept early on, I think, with a younger and maybe not even younger, just less experienced reporter or anyone who's working for a company when you're were asked to go into certain neighborhoods. Is that right? Surely it would be safe because they're asking you to go there, you know, and then this this exemptive having to kind of provide self protection and self awareness because it's actually not in the company's best interest sometimes to think about your welfare or whether or not you should be taking someone else. And I'm wondering about and I think I'm interested in systems that are put into place, particularly across things like broadcasting and things like that and, you know, areas that can be more monitored as to the standards that, you know, that we use. And the news is hard because it's been disbanded and you've got a lot of, you know, different people doing the different kinds of reporting like this Facebook movement. You mentioned the digital DMM, Jay.
[00:17:05] Yet a multimedia journalist. Yeah, I think that point is so valid that systems need to be put in place. But I think it's as a female reporter, it's just creating that relationship with your bosses. And what the assignment desk, who generally knows where you're going and hopefully knows the area well enough so that you can be protected and you're not put in a compromising position.
[00:17:30] Yeah, absolutely. And I mean. And when. Because people are kind of outdoing their own stories that do get picked up. I think it's about kind of being aware yourself. Like you're saying, and putting some of this in order.
[00:17:41] How do you feel about the way that that news has kind of disbanded largely and gone with these, you know, M-m Jay reporters and different Teno people that are kind of picked up these these ad hoc reporters? Do you agree with it? Do you think that it's going to come back? I've talked to people that have said that it might come back into being more of an in-house umbrella eventually once media starts to kind of make sense all the way across the boards. Where do you where you forecast that?
[00:18:10] So that is the question I have asked every CEO I can get my hands on. All right.
[00:18:16] We're in the media in five years. Where do you see media in 10 years? And right now, a lot of people don't know because we're sticking to what we know right now. And that is changing so rapidly. So I see a lot more online content. I mean, you can see different companies like Disney just came out with Disney. Plus I see us having some sort of streaming. We already do have a lot of streaming that we're doing. So, I mean, you've got the impeachment proceedings going on right now. But our evening newscast, if it is if it's the impeachment proceeding, it's still going on. We'll still be live online and through the app so people can still watch it if they choose. So I feel like we are getting most of our audience from social media. So that would be Facebook. We don't really have as much of a hold and Instagram, which is where a lot of people have moved. And I think that there will be a lot of figuring out to do in that realm as well. It's just also kind of figuring out what the tide is, because Facebook was really popular and then it kind of waned a little bit. And then Instagram has become the big cheese in that realm. So I think it's going to be I don't think we're going to have the old days ever again of two man or three man crews going out. There used to be a three man or four man crew that would go out for a live shot. You'd have an audio guy, maybe a field producer, a videographer and a reporter. That's national status. And on the local TV level, I think that we're just going to get smaller. We're not going to have many stations and that's going to have pros and cons. I think people eventually, 10 years down the line, are going to realize the true value of news when it starts dissipating. So it's going to be a huge gamble to stay active. Still trying to provide that information that people find useful and find an audience who want to use it.
[00:20:06] Yeah. And I mean, my mind tends to tangent when I play around with some of those, you know, potential outcomes and they goes towards. Right. Hit like A Clockwork Orange moment. And then you can also, I can picture coming to completely full circle and coming back into that embodiment of, you know, trusting establishments and institutions that actually up until now have all. But as a woman, I feel like kind of betrayed me.
[00:20:31] You know, in a certain degree. And I kind of want to shift our focus for a second towards that realm. And you may not have a story here or anything to comment, but I am always curious. And you you've come up in the industry, you've you've gone to school for and I'm wondering if there's a market difference between your career and any of those of your male counterparts. You know, we've kind of touched on this issue of like, well, it's it was horribly dangerous to go into that area and I needed to call someone to get them on the phone. But can you cite over particularly because you're the span of what you've done thus far has come up throughout the, you know, me to burst open and prior to that. You've kind of you've got a leg on either side, if you will, of what and what could be seen as this very monumental time in history. And I'm wondering if you can kind of speak to the differences that were before or the change of the voices now or any of those things that are kind of very key in your career right now.
[00:21:30] In my career, I haven't necessarily seen a ton of the media movement inside. I've seen a lot of it outside. We've covered it a time. I think more people are speaking out now because they feel empowered, too, and they feel like someone will actually listen. But inside the news business, I have been extremely fortunate where every counterpart I've ever had is always treated me with respect. So, I mean, I'm sure that there are stories out there, but I'm very, very thankful that I don't have one.
[00:22:03] Yeah, absolutely. And I've talked to a lot of people who have experienced the same. They're like, it's cut. We're covering it. We know it. We're speaking to people. But I have not been one of those, you know, unfortunate people. And that's that's great, too. I think it's it's important to kind of know and put out there and realize and have it on the record because it could be a sign of early change. You know, there's a lot of people who feel like there's a lot of talk and very little change actually being implement implemented or worse yet, a backlash, which is, you know, the the the Tony Robbins kind of, you know, speaking with people that are too terrified to deal with women because they don't want to have any issues going forward and victimizing the victim, victim and things of that nature. But it's good to, I think, kind of get some stories out there where people are fortunate enough not to have had some egregious major incident happen, especially since you are covering a lot of them.
[00:22:56] I think there has been a lot of change, though. I think that human resources. I think they've gone through a change as well when it comes to how to handle those situations. And I think that people, again, are going a little bit more frequently to speak on those issues.
[00:23:15] Yes. I think there has been can can happen enough. Definitely. I hope there is change. And there have been a lot there's an advent of new industry in, you know, in corporate business, building and making and, you know, things like emotional intelligence and discovering that the job landscape has really opened up under. I believe, some of the tutelage of the aftermath of Neetu and things like that. But I definitely think that there is a I know that there's a lot of work yet to be done, but it's good to hear people say occasionally that they haven't had, you know, major moments, at least with the the difficulties that we had just learned about kind of being oppressive for so many women and non Byner individuals. I'm wondering what some of the greatest difficulties for you have been thus far in your career? Was it was it job hunting, scouting and jumping from different places, making yourself available? What have been your difficulties thus far?
[00:24:14] The biggest challenge and anyone who's been a reporter who's jumped from market to market can tell you this going to a new place, a brand new place. You've never been you don't know anyone. You don't know a soul and you don't know much about the city. It's so hard to get grounded and make friends and find your. What do we call it? You you girl.
[00:24:42] Describe your tribe.
[00:24:44] Thank you. And going and picking up and moving again. It's just it's really hard to find your tribe. Be supportive of yourself. It was a huge learning experience for me about myself and finding myself, because that's really how you find yourself. You go somewhere by yourself and you kind of are open to all these different facets. Yeah, that makes any sense.
[00:25:12] Absolutely. Did you find that social media was any help with that? Did you ever find that we'll meet ups or anything like that, or was it always just still a little jarring?
[00:25:22] You know, I I was always kind of nervous to do something like that. I know that that sounds silly, cause instead what I did when I joined the junior league and I joined in Bakersfield and then transferred over to Baltimore and then transferred over here. And that was a huge help, women helping women in community. And it was just really nice to meet other women who are professional and are college educated and just had a lot in common. So that was everything to me in Bakersfield. I actually felt like I was home there.
[00:25:55] Yeah. Let me unpack that a little bit. Can you tell us what Junior League is and kind of about the mentorship model that you do with that?
[00:26:03] Yes, I mean, it is an organization of women helping women. So we do training as well as we help others in the community. I mean, in Bakersfield, they created the zoo out there, which was incredible. In Baltimore, they have a wonderful. I think it's called the wise penny. Sorry. It's been a few years where they so partially used clothing to help, you know, underserved women out here we have today, which is transition age, foster youth. And it's just so great to be able to mentor other women in the community and help them find a place. Really? You know, when it comes to volunteerism and then growing themselves.
[00:26:46] Yeah. Absolutely. And I think that it's a it's a direct outlet. Like you're saying, and it helps you put people. I mean, it's an incredible way to socially network. Right. To contribute to a little bit and find people who are involved in what you want to do. So you get involved with it in Bakersfield. And then did you did you continue being involved with it? And when you came to San Diego?
[00:27:07] Yes, absolutely, I'm actually. We had a training tonight for the new girl that are coming into the league. So it's very exciting to see people come in and be excited and want to volunteer. I love it.
[00:27:20] Absolutely. That's a cool way to do it as well. And a cool way to meet people, as you're saying, when you when you have a job that moves you from place to place.
[00:27:28] I was speaking to write this the other day who got her bearings in the army, which had more of a camaraderie and a family build. And then she was a cosmetic nurse. And then she did time on the burn ward as well in the children's hospital here. And she said that her biggest struggle wasn't the know. She had these very high intensive jobs and her biggest trouble wasn't that what exactly we're talking about? It's like reacclimated to these social environments that she would drop into because she was this kind of R.N. for hire. So she had these six month stints everywhere she went. And she said it was just nice, you know, trying to really find two in the process of knowing one surroundings. And I just as naively asked her what I asked you. I thought, you know, what's this social totally help with that. She said, no, it doesn't. On that level, she felt like social media kept her connected globally with her friends, but not actually to develop a microcosm of a community within the places that she was landing. So it's interesting that that obviously there is going to be a lot of jobs that have that in common with one another. Looking forward, what do you have? Like do you have goals with what you're doing, a KGTV in San Diego or just as a media professional in general? You know, is this multimedia journalist, you have future goals that you want to see yourself kind of uncover, or are you just moving along the trajectory? Is it set in front of you through KGTV?
[00:28:49] I would love to set roots here and build and continue being a reporter and growing my sources. And just what I can tell in the community and eventually I would really love to make something bigger. I mean, I have a couple of leadership positions currently, and I would just love to see where that takes me and what opportunities open up. And I know that that sounds really vague, but we've got to be careful right now.
[00:29:18] Now it is. Everyone's got to be careful when you're referring to anything specifically. But that does make sense in setting in routes and dealing with sources.
[00:29:25] You know, that's it. And that's a long game, right? That's like something always out over 20 years. So I respect that process.
[00:29:35] Thank you. Well, it's amazing when you when you foster a relationship with a source and you start learning more. There's just so much more that we can talk about. I feel like in this day and age, everything's covered up under so much red tape that it's very difficult to do real investigative journalism. But once you create those relationships and the door would open up, there's ways that we can help, you know, and really start to monitor things that aren't necessarily correct or the way that they should be running.
[00:30:06] Right. So it's important.
[00:30:07] Absolutely. What do you think some of the like the core tenants, like the ethos of KGTV are that you have in common with. Is there Ed, is there kind of like in an essence that happens at the station that you kind of continue on with with your career? Or is there like a divergence? Can you speak to any issues like the environment behind the scenes at K.g?
[00:30:32] We have. It's so funny that you ask that, because since the first day I walked into the building, I have known that this is where I'm supposed to be. It is so. And I'm sorry. I know this sounds so tremendously dramatic, but it's there is so many leaders. There's so many people who are just so good at their job and they're so creative. I am so lucky to work with the people I work with. When you walk in. You see Emmys on celebrity guests and different awards. And it's just incredible, the talented people. I am fortunate enough to be a mom and to learn from. I think that's the best thing about our station, is I can go up to anyone and say, hey, I love how you did this. How did you do it? Can you teach me? How did you kind of get someone to open up on this question? You know, it's just a huge learning environment, a huge growing environment. And we have some incredible leaders who really want everybody to grow. It's it's very supportive, which is huge and is huge.
[00:31:34] And a little rare sometimes, I think. Oh, very brave. Yeah. A ton of news rooms, but in a lot of environments in general. In business, I think that that's rare, you know, finding people who are really good.
[00:31:45] They do. That's a little bit of a search. But that can be done by finding people who are good at what they do. And we'll walk you through it. You know, that's lovely. Absolutely. So if you were running into somebody tomorrow who was just coming out of you, the Cronkite school, and just they said, listen, I'm gonna get you no neck deep into news and I can't wait, I'm going to learn everything I can. What are the three pieces of advice you would give her?
[00:32:14] Three pieces of advice I would give her. What would I want to know at that time? I was so lucky when I interviewed with McKillip her when I was in eighth grade because she told me everything I need to know. It's going to be hard. You're going to work weekends and holidays, not gonna get paid a ton. A lot of people think we get paid a ton and we make up people. Not true. But you know what? We do love what we do. And when we get to cover some really neat things and go on some extreme experiences like Meghan Perry, our meteorologists got to fly with the Blue Angels. I'm waiting for my turn in the seat. Yeah. And I'm hoping for it. I mean, you read that I got to hang out with the Globetrotters. They were so nice and so funny. Oh, my goodness. And it'll be it'll be hard because sometimes you're going to be talking to people on their worst days. I cannot tell you how many mothers I've interviewed who've lost their children and how horribly upsetting and traumatic that is. But in a way, we're kind of therapists and we can try and help them a little bit and maybe give them some solace that the memory of their child will live on and our peace as brief as it is. I would also say keep trying. Don't give up, because things will seem hard in a moment. But that's what it is. It's just a moment. So always continue. Striving and find what makes you happy, find your niche and own it and never stop working hard to get better because that's what's going to keep you valuable is your drive to continue to work hard.
[00:33:47] Nice. So it's going to be hard. Discover new things.
[00:33:53] You're going to discover new things and do great things. Keep trying. Things are hard in the moment. Find your niche and persevere.
[00:34:00] I like it. Yep.
[00:34:01] That's very cool. Have a great pieces of advice. I love that. Well, we are all out of time. But Cassie, I want to say thank you so much.
[00:34:10] I've got you in the middle of a cold in the middle of a train in San Diego. And I know you're horribly busy. And I just want to say dry. You drive by. All three of those things for meaninglessly.
[00:34:21] Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me. It's been an absolute pleasure.
[00:34:24] Thank you so much. And for everyone listening, thank you so much for your time until you speak again. Remember to always bet on yourself. Slaínte.
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