All Knowing is Relational, From Bottom and How Far Up? With John Vervaeke and Mary Kochen

This was part 2 of our three way conversation. Here is part 1. https://youtu.be/DIoppyflMwg

At John's invitation the three of us got together to talk about the relationship between dialogue, dia-logos and narrative. It was great fun. You can find John's channel here  @John Vervaeke   https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCpqDUjTsof-kTNpnyWper_Q and Mary's channel here https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC2leFZRD0ZlQDQxpR2Zd8oA

Convo Notes
Parabolic knowledge

4-ps of knowing

Brain function as it relates to Relevance Realization

Self-organizing criticality and small world networks

Brain is adapted to make optimum use of limited resources

Trade-offs and optimum efficiency

Single points of failure would be critical, or redundancy but less efficient

Trade-off shows off in the way the brain organizes its own neural networks

Small world networks provide optimum value between 

Brain is constantly building networks, the way they are firing together

Pattern is being built. Billions created and dissolved, 

They fall away and re-configure, similar to self-organizing criticality

Tornado, grains of sand

Relate this to parabolic knowing

Structure, more like a forest packed with the trees one right next to the other

All the trees connecting with one another

The Firing looks like a random thing

Blue brain project

Round work brain, rat brains

Hyper-dimensional polyhedrons

Could have called parabolic knowledge "analogical" 

Interpretation is getting locked down rather than opening up

Laying side by side, but the one to one kind of things

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dedre_Gentner, theory of analogy

Analogy is more strict

A car collides with a truck, the woman hit the man

A is to B and Y is to Z

Bird is to wing, as fish is to fin

Bird is to wing, as blank is to fin (fish)

The sun is to the planet as the nucleus is to the electrons

In terms of geometry

Triangle doodling, this is already an analogy

It's a flip

It's an analogy of the one that was there before

The planets are not doing calculus, that is what is happening, it is adding dimensions

The same thing is going on in the brain inside of these neural networks, collapses inside of the brain itself the possibility space, it's trying to get to that small world network, it's a analogic function even with regard to the structure of the brain

The logic collapse the combinatorially explosive network 

Want to take the logic down into the chain of life. The deep continuity

All of those little sponges are organized and it will still be that a is to b as y is to z 

Movement, 

Hypothalamus place neurons, rat watching the same neurons will fire

Anything that has to move to maintain the integrity of that movement has that same logical function

People that religious framework are taking seriously! 

Recursivity: a system is recursive, scale and variant, if they were identical there would be no point in doing it

Deep continuity as something different from reduction

The language of collapse, only because the brain is doing self-organizing criticality and small world organization is why it scales and 

The system is doing relevance realization

 knife, fork and spoon, daddy, mommy, baby

Propositional
Perspectival
Participatory
Procedural

Prepositional: on, in, to, (relational) 

Parabolic
Proverbial

"The effect being in the cause"

Wing to bird is a part-whole relationship

All knowing is mapping relations

Every kind of knowing is this process

The functional relationship: Mary Douglas: people look to structural, functional relationships

 

Relating
Desire

Relevance realization is about caring
Salience, affect, motivation

Have to take care of myself

Auto-poetic, take care of themselves

Nemotots

Science smuggling in 

Deep continuity

Symbolic world in dialogue with deep continuity

Distributive cognition is the up from deep 

Evan Thompson

 

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